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PostPosted: Wed Apr 24, 2024 10:07 am 
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I have noticed that there has been a huge reduction in participation on this forum for the last couple of years. Even when people actually do put a post, rarely does anybody reply to it. I see a LOT of "drive-by's", but not many who stop to participate in the forum. Even the mods aren't present much.

Is that indicative of karaoke in the real world as well in your areas, nobody cares? Maybe, just maybe, karaoke has lost it's appeal everywhere... I don't know. Your thoughts?

If I don't see participation, then I know that this forum is truly at an end.


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PostPosted: Wed Apr 24, 2024 11:51 pm 
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I was an active member here for several years, but haven't participated much as of late. I re-located from central Canada to the east coast going on two years ago, and that seemed to coincide with my drop in activity here.

One thing's for certain though. Karaoke has not lost it's appeal in this area. Here, in my small town of about five thousand souls, there's karaoke three nights a week, of which I host one, and in neighbouring venues within a ten mile radius, there's at least five or six more.

I've visited most of these venues, and it seems the average attendance of singers would be somewhere between twenty and thirty-five with an additional fifty percent of non-singers. Mine is on the low side, but then, I'm in a small Legion hall.

Now, the question... Why has activity fallen off here? My personal belief is that personalities and egos got in the way. At it's height, this was the "go to" place for information on anything to do with karaoke. Members, especially long-time members would be only too happy to jump in to help in any way they could. But know-it-all egos and name-calling began to outweigh information. When you effectively call someone an idiot because they don't use the same hosting program as you, folks like me will shy away from this place, while many will abandon it altogether.

I'm sure there are other factors in play... Facebook forums and the like for instance... but I feel the number one contributor to the site's decline is, as I said... egos, and sometimes near hostility.

Your mileage may vary.

Cheers from beautiful Cape Breton Island

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PostPosted: Mon Apr 29, 2024 6:10 pm 
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mrscott wrote:
I have noticed that there has been a huge reduction in participation on this forum for the last couple of years. Even when people actually do put a post, rarely does anybody reply to it. I see a LOT of "drive-by's", but not many who stop to participate in the forum. Even the mods aren't present much.

Is that indicative of karaoke in the real world as well in your areas, nobody cares? Maybe, just maybe, karaoke has lost it's appeal everywhere... I don't know. Your thoughts?

If I don't see participation, then I know that this forum is truly at an end.



Karaoke in the real world is certainly not dead, it's extremely popular in many countries. My friends just traveled to Japan and could not believe the amount of Karaoke venues they saw there. Obviously Karaoke is deeply rooted in Asian culture but they said they were thriving everywhere. My friends in the UK told me that Karaoke is extremely popular there too. They told me about a very large venue that just opened up in London that they are very excited to try. They said Karaoke did die down for a while in the UK but is coming back strong. I also heard somewhere that Karaoke in central Canada is going very well! Lol.

Sadly as explained to me by you and many, Karaoke for so many different reasons is on life support in the States but it is certainly not dead yet. There are still many venues that are thriving, unfortunately not as many as before. So many things have changed in the last few years but the optimist in me thinks that Karaoke will make a big comeback in the States but it may take a little time. Americans love to sing (especially after a couple of drinks, lol) and I believe many, myself included, are just waiting for a good experience here in S. Florida. A good experience is key to get people out and singing again. There is a market for it. I am confident that someone (perhaps someone with some $) will figure it out and many will follow in their footsteps. Afterall, New York, the city that never sleeps, was declared dead as a doornail but it’s making a big comeback.

However and unfortunately, I do think this site is dead and as it is an international site it is not an indication of Karaoke trends in the real world. I think it's just done. RIP.


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PostPosted: Wed May 01, 2024 8:23 am 
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I waited a few days to post any further comments on my post, just to give it time.

From my point of view, it looks like the forum has plenty of people who come to visit and check in, but they rarely post anything new. Nor do the respond to many of the threads that already exist. Why? I cannot say, I think each person has their own reasoning. But I do see many of the long time members visit, and I sincerely wish they would let us know how things are going in their individual "neck of the woods", and give us updates once in a while. I also notice there are several long time members who have totally disappeared,,, again I don't really know their individual reasonings. But like Earl so eloquently stated and I whole heartedly agree: inflated egos are the main reason that many users don't want to be involved in the heavy drama that has been so prevalent in the past.

Now when it comes to the real world of karaoke, I'm not so certain that it's prospering or not. In my area (Utah), at very best it's on life support. Many shows have disappeared, and many others are struggling to survive. Even the some of the venues that used to be the hot spots, now are only about half(ish) as busy. Personally I believe that most hosts are not adapting fast enough to the younger crowds needs. Maybe that's because the industry hasn't really advanced either.

Either way, I hope that some of you can take a minute or two and let us know your thoughts. If not, then I think Phil should just pull the plug on this forum and save himself some money.


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PostPosted: Wed May 01, 2024 9:04 am 
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I see mixed attendance at the local shows. Last night, it could have been busier.
Taco Tuesday at the Elks Lodge was fun, I was able to sing three.
The KJ was good, but slower than he could have been.
A couple of singers were not English singers and opera seemed off key.
People started leaving a bit early after the opera guy.
But, the tacos were good.

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PostPosted: Fri May 03, 2024 8:02 pm 
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Just to put my own experience into perspective... my first "on air" gig took place in the fall of 1966... My first mobile DJ business launched the summer of 1977... And my entrance into the world of karaoke-hosting happened twenty-two years ago, give or take a few months... Granted these were side hustles for the most part, at least until I retired from the Fire Service, and then became supplements to my pension(s).

I sometimes tell people that "I've been around so long, my first amplifier was coal-fired and steam-powered".

I tell you this because, even though I've been around the block once or twice, I'd always found a wealth of new-to-me information in these forums. I also like to think that I've been able to contribute from time to time as well. Of course an added bonus would be the cyber friendships I've picked up along the way.

Now, before I make any suggestions, you should know that, if this place dies, my personal karaoke business won't suffer in any appreciable way. It is secure for the foreseeable future.

So, here's my suggestion(s)... Let's cool down the rhetoric, the hyper-inflated egos, and the know-it-all-itis. And let's get back to "people helping people". I personally don't want to hear "Hosting program XYZ is the ONLY worthwhile one available." If you want to say that in your opinion, it's the best... that's fine. I'll respect your opinion. I also don't want to hear "ALL contests are fixed, or bogus in some way". If you want to say that "some contests may be fixed or bogus", I'll accept that too. You could suggest to someone that their (brand name) speakers might not be appropriate for commercial purposes without calling them garbage. I could give a dozen more examples, but hopefully you see what I mean.

I'm not asking everyone to become a diplomat... far from it. All I'm saying is that none of us are perfect, and if we keep our eyes and ears open, and our mouths under control, we might just learn something of value... we might help keep karaoke alive... and these forums might once again prosper.

With all that said, I'm willing to stick around for a while.

Be well Folks, and best wishes from Cape Breton Island.

Earl

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PostPosted: Sun May 05, 2024 11:27 am 
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There is definitely a decline in karaoke, at least in my neck of the woods which is in Michigan. I believe this is due to the pandemic and the economy.

I lost two good jobs because of the pandemic. One of them was a Friday and Saturday night gig. The pandemic forced this establishment to close on weekends and so I lost that one.

The other one (Monday) was doing great before the pandemic but when everything was able to reopen again, it just wasn't the same and the owner decided to do away with karaoke altogether.

And my other job (Wednesday), which used to be great, suffered a great loss when most of the regular singers decided to become Eagle members since drinks and food were a lot cheaper at these clubs.

Right now, I am working at 3 different venues. I can definitely see a decline from the way things used to be. The days of 25 to 35 singers are gone. Now it's more like 10 to 15. 20 on a good night.

And I believe the economy is to blame. Food prices are through the roof. It now costs at least $50 more for the same items you would normally buy. And manufactures have cut their portion sizes as well. You're now paying more and getting less.

Since people are paying extra at the grocery store, many don't have the extra money to go out. If the choice is food or karaoke... food is going to win.

So, no, it is not the same. The higher the food and gas prices get, the less people are going to go out. Because that extra money is gone.

So, I believe these are the reasons for the decline.

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PostPosted: Sun May 05, 2024 6:47 pm 
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Here in Los Angeles, we seem to have a surge in shows.
That being said, revenues seems to be dropping off.
Karaoke can be profitable, but I see the shows cycle up and down,
due to "Everybody wants to sing" but it's too crowded.
Singers leave looking for a show that's not crowded.
The KJ that can't control rotation will lose singers.
Step up your game..
That being said, I support all the shows here.
I attend, sing, buy drinks and food.
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PostPosted: Tue May 07, 2024 7:08 am 
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Alan B wrote:
There is definitely a decline in karaoke, at least in my neck of the woods which is in Michigan. I believe this is due to the pandemic and the economy.

I lost two good jobs because of the pandemic. One of them was a Friday and Saturday night gig. The pandemic forced this establishment to close on weekends and so I lost that one.

The other one (Monday) was doing great before the pandemic but when everything was able to reopen again, it just wasn't the same and the owner decided to do away with karaoke altogether.

And my other job (Wednesday), which used to be great, suffered a great loss when most of the regular singers decided to become Eagle members since drinks and food were a lot cheaper at these clubs.

Right now, I am working at 3 different venues. I can definitely see a decline from the way things used to be. The days of 25 to 35 singers are gone. Now it's more like 10 to 15. 20 on a good night.

And I believe the economy is to blame. Food prices are through the roof. It now costs at least $50 more for the same items you would normally buy. And manufactures have cut their portion sizes as well. You're now paying more and getting less.

Since people are paying extra at the grocery store, many don't have the extra money to go out. If the choice is food or karaoke... food is going to win.

So, no, it is not the same. The higher the food and gas prices get, the less people are going to go out. Because that extra money is gone.

So, I believe these are the reasons for the decline.


I absolutely agree with you. Covid hurt so many people in so many different ways, me included. Everything is crazy expensive and our economy is in shambles. I don't even know how some people are surviving and making ends meet in these times.

However, I live in a city that is different than most. I live in a city that is flourishing again after Covid. Even though our housing is crazy expensive here, my city continues to grow and gets more and more crowded every year. My city is home to many wealthy and famous people. We have over 10,000 restaurants and bars that are thriving. There are clearly lots of people in my city with extra cash looking for fun things to do.

We have 20ish or so places that offer Karaoke which is nothing in comparison to the amount of restaurants and bars here. Some of these spots are in dive bars with 10-15 older people on a Wednesday or Thursday night from 9PM-11PM. A couple are HUGE very nice club like venues dedicated to Karaoke that also have private Karaoke rooms for rent that are open everyday to 4 or 5 in the morning. These places are usually very expensive, for instance at one of these places, if you would like to sit down it will cost you upwards of $300 for bottle service not including food. Just a side note... I REALLY enjoy a place to sit. It's important to me but I don't want to pay $300! Lol. Others are in bigger bars that have a standing Karaoke night, offer cheap shots and have limited seating. These places get extremely crowded because of the cheap liquor. The last two although very different from each other cater to a very young crowd. None of these 3 options appeal to me, my friends, or probably to anyone over 35 excluding the 10-15 people at the dive bar.

The dynamics of my city is different than most. I think we are in need of some nice venues that cater to a mature crowd. A venue where you can sit, have a couple of drinks, some decent food and sing a couple of songs. There were some (not many) before Covid but they are gone now. From my understanding, it is the mature crowd that really appreciates Karaoke more than the young crowd but we are being left out in my city and I can't figure out why.

I really think that a lot of people of all ages truly like to sing and have fun with it. I truly believe if you build it (right), they will come but I am obviously missing something.


Last edited by Dakota on Wed May 08, 2024 6:10 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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PostPosted: Tue May 07, 2024 5:41 pm 
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Based on the amount of karaoke bars vs all of those thousands of bars not offering karaoke, you have a golden opportunity of getting some hosting jobs. I'm sure you can convince bar owners of the benefits of hiring you and you'd probably be better than most karaoke hosts. You already have equipment that, as you say, is better than what most hosts use. I think you should go for it. And even if you don't need the money, you'd be offering a great service to the community and be doing something you like. By the way, what city are we talking about?

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PostPosted: Wed May 08, 2024 6:05 pm 
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Alan B wrote:
Based on the amount of karaoke bars vs all of those thousands of bars not offering karaoke, you have a golden opportunity of getting some hosting jobs. I'm sure you can convince bar owners of the benefits of hiring you and you'd probably be better than most karaoke hosts. You already have equipment that, as you say, is better than what most hosts use. I think you should go for it. And even if you don't need the money, you'd be offering a great service to the community and be doing something you like. By the way, what city are we talking about?


I live in Miami. Extra money is always great but I don't want to host for many reasons. It would be too much for me and I really wouldn't be any good at it but it would absolutely be a golden opportunity for someone else. A good show here is really needed. I can't figure out why there aren't any, at least any that I know about.


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PostPosted: Wed May 08, 2024 6:28 pm 
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Dakota wrote:
Alan B wrote:
Based on the amount of karaoke bars vs all of those thousands of bars not offering karaoke, you have a golden opportunity of getting some hosting jobs. I'm sure you can convince bar owners of the benefits of hiring you and you'd probably be better than most karaoke hosts. You already have equipment that, as you say, is better than what most hosts use. I think you should go for it. And even if you don't need the money, you'd be offering a great service to the community and be doing something you like. By the way, what city are we talking about?


I live in Miami. Where are you located? Extra money is always great but I don't want to host for many reasons. It would be too much for me and I really wouldn't be any good at it but it would absolutely be a golden opportunity for someone else. A good show here is really needed. I can't figure out why there aren't any, at least any that I know about.


Actually, that may be the root of the problem itself!! The lack of quality hosts and venues :-? I wont disagree that having good sound, fair and fun host are a bonus. So is having a venue that actually supports karaoke. In all those places that I have visited, there have only been a very few select shows that have it "all". There is something that is always lacking, and that even includes the show that I host. A good venue should have good food, great service, attractive pricing, clean and welcoming facility with plenty of seating, a friendly and knowledgeable staff, plus the obvious, "great karaoke". Losing even one of those items will have a huge detriment on the success of the bar, let alone the success of the show. The venue I host at has little to no food, lousy seating, run down and dingy bar, and depending on who is working, either a really great bartender, or a really bad bartender. If it weren't for me hosting even the one night per week, they probably would close their doors, even tho karaoke struggles too.

This is what I am talking about,,,,, the "average" bar goer doesn't really care about karaoke. The number one reason people choose a bar to go to is location,,, "how far they have to drive". The second reason is attractive pricing... it gets a bit less predictable after that. But, even karaoke is far down the list for the "average" person at the local bars.

In the entire country, there are only a handful of cities that are large enough to be able to specialize in the type of specific venue in order to attract a larger ratio of karaoke patrons,,, and that is patrons who will spend money. Sadly, the bars rely on the customers who are there to drink, visit and really don't participate in the karaoke show. The vast majority of clubs/bars/venues have to diverse their types of entertainment because there just isn't enough to pack the house with a "karaoke crowd". It's been said, that only 5% of the population has event tried to sing publicly at karaoke,,, let alone become regulars.

Of all the shows I have been to, I have only seen two or three total around the entire 25 or so states that have shown that karaoke itself can be profitable as a main focus. One of them is in Scottsdale Arizona. The population base from around Scottsdale/Phoenix area is 4.7 million people. I believe in order to achieve the type of success that club creates, it's for the most part necessary to have close to million or more people to draw from. Maybe I'm wrong, I don't really have the answer, but I do know what I have seen, and it's not very promising.


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PostPosted: Wed May 08, 2024 9:44 pm 
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Dakota wrote:
Alan B wrote:
Based on the amount of karaoke bars vs all of those thousands of bars not offering karaoke, you have a golden opportunity of getting some hosting jobs. I'm sure you can convince bar owners of the benefits of hiring you and you'd probably be better than most karaoke hosts. You already have equipment that, as you say, is better than what most hosts use. I think you should go for it. And even if you don't need the money, you'd be offering a great service to the community and be doing something you like. By the way, what city are we talking about?


I live in Miami. Extra money is always great but I don't want to host for many reasons. It would be too much for me and I really wouldn't be any good at it but it would absolutely be a golden opportunity for someone else. A good show here is really needed. I can't figure out why there aren't any, at least any that I know about.

How do you know you wouldn't be any good at it unless you try it? As you've said, the only host you really liked and had any respect for was the one who, unfortunately died. The rest all suck... or to put it mildly, are severely lacking. So, with this information, you already know what it takes to be a good host. I have no doubt in my mind that you would do an awesome job and people would love you. And you'd be filling a need for quality karaoke hosts/shows. You just need to believe in yourself. I'm pretty sure, if you gave it a shot, you would be pretty successful. Think about it.

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PostPosted: Thu May 09, 2024 10:22 am 
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Maybe a different way to look at the big picture, and a better question to ask..

Is karaoke dying from lack of customer support because it's less popular? Or is it being killed off by bad hosts, bar owners or management that really do not support karaoke, or venues that don't offer the entire experience? That is; food, attractive pricing, good drinks, great service, plenty of seating, a clean establishment, safe environment, karaoke with a fun, fair host, good sound and lighting, proper stage area,,,, etc... you know, the stuff we all are looking for, but rarely find.

Again, I don't have all the answers, only questions and observations from what I have seen. I do know that here in Utah, it isn't good.


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PostPosted: Thu May 09, 2024 11:38 pm 
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mrscott wrote:
Maybe a different way to look at the big picture, and a better question to ask..

Is karaoke dying from lack of customer support because it's less popular? Or is it being killed off by bad hosts, bar owners or management that really do not support karaoke, or venues that don't offer the entire experience? That is; food, attractive pricing, good drinks, great service, plenty of seating, a clean establishment, safe environment, karaoke with a fun, fair host, good sound and lighting, proper stage area,,,, etc... you know, the stuff we all are looking for, but rarely find.

Again, I don't have all the answers, only questions and observations from what I have seen. I do know that here in Utah, it isn't good.

I would say that based on your two choices, I would choose the latter.

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PostPosted: Fri May 10, 2024 5:41 am 
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mrscott wrote:
Or is it being killed off by bad hosts, bar owners or management that really do not support karaoke, or venues that don't offer the entire experience? That is; food, attractive pricing, good drinks, great service, plenty of seating, a clean establishment, safe environment, karaoke with a fun, fair host, good sound and lighting, proper stage area,,,, etc... you know, the stuff we all are looking for, but rarely find.

I agree with this. If the karaoke is good but the prices are too expensive, people are going to go down the road to the place that's cheaper, even though the karaoke is inferior. Same goes for if the food or service sucks. You're right, it's the whole package.

However, I still believe that the increase in prices at the grocery store has a lot to do with it. That extra "going out" money, now has to be spent on groceries. For many, there is no more "extra". So, since people are now paying more at the stores and at the pump, that leaves little left for going out. I get that. I've had people tell me that they used to go out for karaoke 3 nights a week but had to cut it back to only 1 night because they couldn't afford it anymore.

From my own experience, a grocery shop that used to cost me $100 per week, is now costing me $150 for the exact same items. It's disgusting.

I don't believe that karaoke is any less popular, it's just that customers are being more frugal. I definitely can see a decline but it's not because people are tired of it or don't like it anymore, it's because people can't afford that night out anymore. So, if anything, the economy and rising prices, especially at the grocery store are what's killing karaoke.

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PostPosted: Sat May 11, 2024 2:16 pm 
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Alan B wrote:
mrscott wrote:
Or is it being killed off by bad hosts, bar owners or management that really do not support karaoke, or venues that don't offer the entire experience? That is; food, attractive pricing, good drinks, great service, plenty of seating, a clean establishment, safe environment, karaoke with a fun, fair host, good sound and lighting, proper stage area,,,, etc... you know, the stuff we all are looking for, but rarely find.

I agree with this. If the karaoke is good but the prices are too expensive, people are going to go down the road to the place that's cheaper, even though the karaoke is inferior. Same goes for if the food or service sucks. You're right, it's the whole package.

However, I still believe that the increase in prices at the grocery store has a lot to do with it. That extra "going out" money, now has to be spent on groceries. For many, there is no more "extra". So, since people are now paying more at the stores and at the pump, that leaves little left for going out. I get that. I've had people tell me that they used to go out for karaoke 3 nights a week but had to cut it back to only 1 night because they couldn't afford it anymore.

From my own experience, a grocery shop that used to cost me $100 per week, is now costing me $150 for the exact same items. It's disgusting.

I don't believe that karaoke is any less popular, it's just that customers are being more frugal. I definitely can see a decline but it's not because people are tired of it or don't like it anymore, it's because people can't afford that night out anymore. So, if anything, the economy and rising prices, especially at the grocery store are what's killing karaoke.


Alan, the economy in your area (Michigan) might be a large contributor to the decline of attendance to karaoke. Michigan is listed at 28th out of the 50 as far as that goes. Not having much disposable income would definitely make an impact. However, Utah is the 3rd best in the country, yet the decline is very evident. A large portion of the people here still have the ability to go out more often. So I cannot say that the economy has as big of an impact as you might think. I do agree that the cost of everything has gone up substantially. If the economy is not to blame, there must be another reason(s) for the decline.

Going back to my second observation of the types of shows/venues available to attend, indulge me here and list what you believe to be an ideal venue. And applying that ideal, just how many individual venues/bars have you been to that actually tick all the boxes. For myself, I can think of only two spots out of well over a hundred that I have been to that have it "all". Neither of them are here in Utah either. It may be quite possible that people are demanding more out of their karaoke spots than is being offered. And maybe that is killing the popularity and reputation.


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PostPosted: Sat May 11, 2024 4:14 pm 
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Super Extreme
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Joined: Sun Mar 24, 2002 4:12 pm
Posts: 7692
Songs: 1
Location: Hollyweird, Ca.
Been Liked: 1085 times
I'll Just Post This Here.
Los Angeles Has A Thriving Karaoke Scene. (Pun Intended)
I See "Hosts" That Have No Clue How To Host.
They Don't Last.
Yes, "Users" here Have Drifted Over To The Evil FB.
I am a Moderator For Karaoke Clubs On The Evil FB.
That Being Said, Everyone Fears Change, The Only Constant Is Change.
We Have "Elks" "Moose" And Every Type Of "Social" Group Hosting
Karaoke On A Regular Basis.
I Know Phill, And I Visit Las Vegas With Him From Time To Time.
I've Been Known To sing There.. (Who Knew)


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PostPosted: Sun May 12, 2024 2:06 pm 
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Major Poster
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Joined: Thu Jan 18, 2024 11:12 am
Posts: 72
Been Liked: 26 times
"What would your ideal Karaoke Spot be like?"
That could be a great new topic for someone to start. :D


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PostPosted: Wed May 29, 2024 10:19 am 
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Super Duper Poster
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Joined: Sun Jun 29, 2008 5:49 pm
Posts: 2441
Been Liked: 339 times
It's so quiet in here! :cry:


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