Karaoke Forums

So.... you limit us to one set of answers, but you get to provide your own?




Paranoid suspicions would suggest I believe you are out to get me. I believe you are out to get everyone that has any sort of positive association with the karaoke industry.

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-Chris

Not at all. I simply provided a different explanation for my selection of #1 & #3. You wanted to change my answer(s) to #2 & #4.

You somehow believe that you're in the "positive group" that you claim I'm "out to get?" Really?

I would call that pretty darn paranoid....

Piracy does matter to me. And I have always purchased music from companies who I believe are operating legally.

As a karaoke host, it's very frustrating when a singer requests a song that I don't have. And then proceeds to tell me "everybody has that song". "I can't believe you don't have it". Then I'm told, "just pull it up from YouTube", in which I politely tell them that I can't do that.

Customers and establishment owners don't seem to care where the music comes from or whose hosting karaoke. For example, a recently new establishment opened up using a known pirate company. Not only were they pirates but everybody hated them because they were terrible. Some of my customers who have been there told me that they talked to the owner about hiring me and how much better I was.

So, I go there and talk to the owner, promote myself and why I would be better than who he's got now. I go into my rap on piracy and how he's putting himself at risk of a lawsuit by hiring pirate KJs. He then asked me; why do you care? I told him because piracy is hurting the industry, forcing legal KJ's out of a job and publishers to go out of business.

Anyway, I thanked him for his time and left it at that. Well, several months later, that pirate company is still working for him.

On a related side note...

Sound Choice, among other karaoke producers have been affected by piracy. While you may not agree with their methods, I can understand their motivation for suing for trademark infringement. What was once the premier karaoke brand has been taken away from them by 90% of you. Can you blame them? I would retaliate too.

As far as Mr. Harrington is concerned, he doesn't have to come here and answer any questions, give advice, opinions or divulge any legal information. Having him here is a plus. But many are too stupid to realize that and try to tear him, SC and PEP apart. But having him here is beneficial. Like us, he is only doing his job.

Bottom line: operate legally, purchase legally and comply with the law and you won't have any problems.

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Electro-Voice Evolve 50... Taking Sound To The Next Level.

As far as I see, this thread isn't about Pirate KJs, it is about companies who produce Karaoke without proper licensing, and if it effects us, on a moral level. I am tired of the whole thing. I just want to buy my damn songs, and not worry about who is going to care, or who is getting paid for what. I am here for my singers, not for the convenience of the Karaoke companies. Isn't enough that SC has caused enough trouble with their lawsuits?? Must we sit here and worry about every company that sells Karaoke music?? If they don't sell SC, or a SC like product, (Stingray), I will buy from them, simple as that!!

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I am the ONLY SANE 1 HERE

Well, yes and no. It's a demonstration how KJ's will ignore or justify piracy on the manufacturing level if it serves to benefit them with their patrons and venues. Meanwhile, piracy that directly affects them "is bad and hurts the industry."

Option #1 and #2 are actually the same, but together, they have (currently) 70% of the votes.

i will admit to being a bit of a hypocriteon these issues.

Piracy is a problem, and wherever possible i will try to buy from people that i know are legit. I will always try to get what i want 'legally' first.

However, when push comes to shove, if there is a song that is available that i want, but is not readily available thru 'legal' means, i will take the extra measures to buy it anyway.

The only thing i have NEVER comprimised on is i have ALWAYS bought all of my music after i became a host and found out why karaoke music was so expensive.

So, as a gem licensee, this must be acceptable. But even if you find that a song is not "readily available thru legal means" that doesn't make the piracy of it morally acceptable.

But it perfectly illustrates my point: As long as the pirates are not affecting you directly, it's easy to ignore it. Especially when your main focus is "getting the song(s)."

i will have to re-read my GEM license but i know i am compliant with the main points

1) I do not possess any Soundchoice tracks for commercial use that are not either part of the GEM itself or are from non original media. In other words, every single soundchoice track that i use in my shows are tracks that i have paid for from authorized sources.

2) I have not distributed any of my soundchoice or GEM tracks via torrent or mirc

3) I don't think it would be relivant to the GEM contract i signed, but since Jim has stated he would have an issue with using stringray branded tracks in a show, i stopped using the downloaded tracks i bought from Customburn in the UK

All the other download tracks that i have ever purchased, are from Zoom, SBI and other sources that have absolutely nothing to do with PEP and therefore is none of their concern.

-James

It just ocurred to me.

Zoom, Sbi, Karaoke Version, Customburn etc are all to the best of my knowledge, fully licensed for what they produce and sell.

That means if I use a VPN service to circumvent the IP address blocking, they have done absolutely nothing illegal or illegitimate, I am the one that technically broke the law.

So i am buying from a company who has fufilled all of their legal obligations.. In other words, they are not the ones creating un-authorized music, i am. So in terms of this limited poll i could techically have put a different answer

-James

Forget soundchoice, the point is that you really don't have a problem pirating a song when you can't get it legally, but "piracy is a problem in the industry?" It doesn't appear to be a problem at all.

You can't justify piracy on one hand and condemn it on the other.

I do not condem piracy.. i condemn outright stealing. In other words, those who do not pay ANYTHING for the tracks that they use. THAT is what is making it harder to compete in some areas. The fact that there are people who have no problem with getting there music for free. This is what i am against


The point, from my view is that I PAY for my tracks. Most do not, THAT is what i take issue with and condemn.

At least with me the producer of the track gets paid, AND the rights holder gets paid. No one is left out of the chain.

Is it a justification? Yes, but it's one that i can live with. But i am NOT contridicting myself.

You might want to ask your buddy Harrington on that one. The publisher is being paid for distribution in Europe not through some back door you use to bring it here. So even though you can justify it by claiming you paid something for it, it still piracy and you can't sidestep that.

This is what I mean by "justified piracy."

Carry on.

Do I care... yes and no.

Yes because this industry is in bad enough shape that we can't get karaoke tracks as it is.

But will I look into each and every manufacturer to see about how they handle the legal aspect of the business? Not my job. I expect for my payment that I'm giving them that they are responsible enough to do the right thing.

I am far more concerned about vendors, however. The selling of those mega hard drives really killed the industry and could have resulted in manufacturers trimming the edges to stay in the black.

Some time ago, when I was a baby KJ, I saw the CAVS JB-99 system. It was the pre-laptop era and I was using the a JVC triple tray. I bought one thinking it was great, no more CDs to carry! I found out that it came with a more then a few tracks on it... DK Millennium & Chartbuster I believe. I didn't know better at the time, but it never "felt right" to have those tracks on there. When I asked about the CDs for the system, I was told "we handle that, no problems": a shady response if I ever heard one. In the end, I wiped the hard drive inside the CAVS unit, and and installed my own CDs. I instantly felt better about using the system and used it until I bought a laptop.

I honestly believe there are a few KJs out there that think what they bought is legal, mostly through ignorance of the law. Shady vendors won't tell you what you need to know, and the legal mess falls on on the KJ who gets caught with it.

Even though these days, I only do corporate gigs, I still buy disks as I see them available.

I do prefer the disk still shrink wrapped, but as you may know, pirates can shrink wrap too.

When guns are outlawed, only outlaws will have guns..

Sound familiar?

Insisting on CD+G disks in a digital world seems kinda retarded..

What's the music site that is making billions? Oh I remember, it's iTunes..

"No Disks Allowed" :lmmfao:

I kinda agree with you, that CDs are very much a dinosaur but its also probably the easiest way to 'prove' you have ready access to the material legally.

TM, that is exactly why I have all the discs I do.

And, based on the copyright lawsuits and settlements that have been flying around this industry from publishers for years, some of those "shady vendors" have turned out to be the very manufacturers you believed and trusted would've been operating above board.

Piracy is something that is pervasive all the way up the chain.

Not new info..
Anyone checking my posts will see I've complained about fake CD+G disks for sale for years..

Vegas has two brick and mortar stores.. One Legit, one packed full of burns.

I found a garage full of SGB disks not that long ago.. I posted, nobody asked where they were. Eff it.. You can only do so much..

I'm done for today..

Which is another reason I think this poll is more of a means to find people to pick on. (see Chip's response to jclaydon).

We all know that some former disc producers, in fact many of them, did not license properly. Yet those discs are still in our libraries.

We all have questionable material in our libraries. Even Chip.

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-Chris

Actually i do not feel like i am being picked on. Technically speaking, chip is correct. By the strictest definitions, i am using a justification to obtain the tracks that i want to sing.

Where I disagree with him is when he calls it a double standard. I have NEVER said i have never pirated tracks. Anyone who has been on this board long enough will have seen my posts on how I used to frequent irc on a regular basis before i tried to become a host.

The thing is, i now know better. I know the damage outright stealing *ie paying absolutely nothing* does to the industry and i made a promise to myself that i wouldn't do it anymore. I also vowed i would not support any producer that i KNOW was outright stealing their tracks. To the best of my knowledge, soundchoice at least always paid something for licensing *whether it was proper or not is for another debate* so I still support them. Zoom, SBI, are all paying the licensing they need to to produce songs, so I support them.

Until a week ago, I also bought from tricerasoft. I still believe that they were trying to do the right thing at least, but until everything is resolved I will only use up my current credits.

You want to talk about a real double standard, I would bet a whole year's income that the publishers who are making this big stink had NO reservations about cashing the royality checks they got for YEARS from the uk producers before they decided to get greedy and insist on more money.

The bottom line, as far as i am concerned, is 'pay for what you use' and that is EXACTLY what i advocate and support for as long as I am involved in karaoke

The other issues are secondary.


So bottom line, yes it is a justification but my concience is still clean and i can live with it.

-James