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PostPosted: Fri Apr 06, 2018 11:37 am 
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The Lone Ranger wrote:
Alan B wrote:
The bottom line (for me anyway) is that contests suck. They do more harm than good. They're never judged fairly and cause a lot of hard feelings. I hate them with a passion and want no part of them.

It's funny how people show up for a contest that you've never seen before, and after they win, you never see them again.

Contests are not cool. Did I mention how much I hate them?



8) When I was hosting full time I worked very hard to build up a feeling of comradeship between my regular singers. A singing contest destroys in a short period of time this feeling of mutual respect. Any benefit hoped for by the venue as far as increased traffic is a sugar rush, and will only last as long as the contest continues. In over 20 years of hosting I only have hosted one contest, and that was because it wasn't a regular gig of mine. I did none of the judging and only acted as the air traffic controller for that evening.

P.S. Did I mention that what you usually do as a host is good most nights, on contest night everyone is a diva, or you made someone look bad on purpose, it was fixed, worst host ever I didn't win, you didn't make me sound like Elvis. Have plenty of extra bar towels handy for all the crying.


Interesting perspective, from the 'inside'. What I was starting to wonder, myself, is if being in a contest would smash the feeling of comradeship between members of the local karaoke family. Right now, we're all arm in arm swaying to "Sweet Caroline", or dancing on the floor together to "Time Warp", but when we're jostling for position for that podium? Could I stand to progress if it means one of my friends does not? I'm OK with the shoe being on the other foot, because I have back up plans and I just love getting the chance to sing. So that's all good if I don't progress in a competition, but I have been wondering how these things affect the comradeship, which, in the end, is one of the main things karaoke is about.


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PostPosted: Fri Apr 06, 2018 12:12 pm 
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I have found the regulars who aren't competing in the contest because they don't consider themselves, whether it's the truth or not, good enough to win the contest get frustrated because they are not getting to sing as much as they used to. Some of them decide to go to other shows going on and forget about coming back after the contest has ended and the other regulars who do think that they have what it takes to win get pissed off enough to go elsewhere if they don't win.

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PostPosted: Fri Apr 06, 2018 12:27 pm 
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DannyG2006 wrote:
I have found the regulars who aren't competing in the contest because they don't consider themselves, whether it's the truth or not, good enough to win the contest get frustrated because they are not getting to sing as much as they used to. Some of them decide to go to other shows going on and forget about coming back after the contest has ended and the other regulars who do think that they have what it takes to win get pissed off enough to go elsewhere if they don't win.


Sounds like walking barefoot through a room with lots of lego strewn across the floor.


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PostPosted: Fri Apr 06, 2018 12:30 pm 
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Back to the opening question:

What I've gleaned, so far, from this thread about that is:
Save the best for last.
And so, I suppose, start with one of your stronger songs; then two other, obviously fabulous but not your most amazing songs; and if you get to the final round, hit them with your most amazing shot. ?

And that, when deciding which song is 'best' audience appeal is king.


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PostPosted: Fri Apr 06, 2018 1:53 pm 
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CruneMeATune wrote:
Back to the opening question...

My friend...

I'm sure you're a fabulous singer. I'm sure people love seeing (and hearing) your performance. With that said, there is a reason why I and many of my colleagues despise contests. Let's look at a few of the reasons...

With over 20 years experience in this business, I've never seen a contest that was judged fairly. I've seen favoritism come into play many times over impartially. Most of the judges had no qualifications relating to music or a musical background. And as always is the case, someone who was inferior to the best singer ends up winning.

Karaoke is supposed to be fun for everyone but I've seen contests cause hurt feelings, animosity, anger, and frustration. This is NOT what karaoke is about. But yet, contests are a great way to make someone feel inferior about themselves. Yes, contests can shatter someone's self esteem and actually drive people away.

And then you have the Diva's who make a living off of contests. These are the people who know where all the contests are going to be and enter every one. These people are really good and know how to win. And once they do, you never see them again. Which is not fair to the people who come out week after week supporting the bar. It's really a slap in the face.

Like I said, contests cause more harm than good. I've seen several friendships lost over a contest. I know, it's crazy.

So my friend, my advice to you is keep your sanity and don't enter but if you must, take the contest with a grain of salt. Look at it as something for entertainment value, NOT as an indication of singing ability. Because so many times, your singing skills have nothing to do with winning.

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PostPosted: Fri Apr 06, 2018 2:58 pm 
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Jesus, just let him do the contest, he didn't ask about how much you hate them.
Ps my contests are very fair so they do exist

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PostPosted: Fri Apr 06, 2018 6:25 pm 
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Alan B wrote:
CruneMeATune wrote:
Back to the opening question...

My friend...

I'm sure you're a fabulous singer. I'm sure people love seeing (and hearing) your performance. With that said, there is a reason why I and many of my colleagues despise contests. Let's look at a few of the reasons...

With over 20 years experience in this business, I've never seen a contest that was judged fairly. I've seen favoritism come into play many times over impartially. Most of the judges had no qualifications relating to music or a musical background. And as always is the case, someone who was inferior to the best singer ends up winning.

Karaoke is supposed to be fun for everyone but I've seen contests cause hurt feelings, animosity, anger, and frustration. This is NOT what karaoke is about. But yet, contests are a great way to make someone feel inferior about themselves. Yes, contests can shatter someone's self esteem and actually drive people away.

And then you have the Diva's who make a living off of contests. These are the people who know where all the contests are going to be and enter every one. These people are really good and know how to win. And once they do, you never see them again. Which is not fair to the people who come out week after week supporting the bar. It's really a slap in the face.

Like I said, contests cause more harm than good. I've seen several friendships lost over a contest. I know, it's crazy.

So my friend, my advice to you is keep your sanity and don't enter but if you must, take the contest with a grain of salt. Look at it as something for entertainment value, NOT as an indication of singing ability. Because so many times, your singing skills have nothing to do with winning.



Bravo! I Applaud You. Like or dislike contests,
there are definitely more cons. I attended a
Contest one time in which i caught a loaded
Handshake, i whispered to my tablemates that
I knew who would win, and pointed out the
Culprit. Sure enough, i was proven correct at the
Close of the Show, its hard to find a fairly judged
Contest, the fairest contest i ever saw, was where
The KJ gave out pen and paper and had all write
The number of the contestant in the order that
They sang, each sang three rounds, and a winner
was declared by the most votes! all for a $25.00
Bar tab! LOL.


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PostPosted: Fri Apr 06, 2018 7:01 pm 
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Wow. That's quite a can of worms I opened with this question.

Even so, I appreciate you folks taking the time to answer. You've given me a lot of insight.

I'm up for hearing more about song choices and their order. :)


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PostPosted: Fri Apr 06, 2018 7:06 pm 
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Lonman wrote:
Jesus, just let him do the contest, he didn't ask about how much you hate them.
Ps my contests are very fair so they do exist


Thanks for swooping in to the rescue.

Oh - and just for the record I have two X chromosomes. :wink: I guess it's time I found a profile pic.


Last edited by CruneMeATune on Fri Apr 06, 2018 11:12 pm, edited 2 times in total.

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PostPosted: Fri Apr 06, 2018 7:22 pm 
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Alan B wrote:

And then you have the Diva's who make a living off of contests. These are the people who know where all the contests are going to be and enter every one. These people are really good and know how to win. And once they do, you never see them again. Which is not fair to the people who come out week after week supporting the bar. It's really a slap in the face.


Alan, if you never saw this movie, watch "Jackpot" (with Jon Gries, Garret Morris, and Peggy Lipton). It was pretty bad, but I think it was better than "Duets."


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PostPosted: Fri Apr 06, 2018 7:28 pm 
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CruneMeATune wrote:
Wow. That's quite a can of worms I opened with this question.

Even so, I appreciate you folks taking the time to answer. You've given me a lot of insight.

I'm up for hearing more about song choices and their order. :)


You've described the type of songs you are planning to sing. How about giving us the song titles too? Also, you should find out if there are any restrictions to what you are allowed to sing... for example, do you have to choose from a specific song list, or can you sing whatever you want? If the KJ hosting the contest does not have your specific song choice, can you supply the KJ with your own song track (if the KJ is able to play it), or must you use only song track from that KJ's collection? I once did some creative cheating in a contest I was in many years ago. One of the rules was, you could only sing from what the KJ owned. I had a powerful Broadway song which I was very confident in, and the KJ did not have that song in her library. I went out and bought the disc, and then mailed it to her months before the finals (and she added it to her library).

BTW... I know others have already stated this, and I will say it too. Save your best for last.

I know it's a gamble that you might not make it to the final round to do that, but if you sing your best song in any other order, the Judges could be predisposed to judging your next song (if you get a next song) based on how well you did your best song, and not on the song you currently sang.


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PostPosted: Fri Apr 06, 2018 10:00 pm 
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Lonman wrote:
Ps my contests are very fair so they do exist

Yours may be one of the rare exceptions. Most of the contests that I've seen have been based on favoritism, who knows who, or how well that girl can "strut her stuff". You know, eye candy. Rarely have I seen anybody win because of their vocal ability. Because of this, the value of a contest is diminished and has no merit.

Your contests may be in the top 5% that are done right. But sadly, the other 95% are not.

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PostPosted: Fri Apr 06, 2018 11:13 pm 
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What of the International Karaoke Competition? Do you feel that one plays out fairly?


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PostPosted: Fri Apr 06, 2018 11:42 pm 
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CruneMeATune wrote:
What of the International Karaoke Competition? Do you feel that one plays out fairly?

The majority of contests that I am referring to are the ones held at venues such as bars and night clubs. Since I have no experience with the International Karaoke Competition, I am not qualified to speak about how it is run. I would like to think that it is run fairly and honestly. Then again, I'd like to think that our president is honest too but we all know better than that.

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PostPosted: Sat Apr 07, 2018 6:08 am 
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CruneMeATune wrote:

Thanks for swooping in to the rescue.


Seriously? Rescue from what? My honesty? Because I was sharing some information that you didn't want to hear?

Look, the reality is that everything that I have stated in my post above does happen. It's a fact. We've all experienced it. I'm not saying that it happens with every single contest, there ARE some good ones as Lonnie has pointed out, but the fact remains, there are more bad ones than good ones.

Here's one for you... I remember a KJ friend of mine telling me about a contest where the judges had already decided on a winner before any contestant even sang a single note!!!!!

I am only trying to be insightful and share what I've seen happen in all my years as a professional KJ and the reason why I hate them so much. If you choose to be naive and discount what I'm saying, so be it. But like it or not, that's the reality of contests.

I wish you the best of luck with yours. I can only hope it is run and judged fairly.

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PostPosted: Sat Apr 07, 2018 9:14 am 
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Alan B wrote:
CruneMeATune wrote:

Thanks for swooping in to the rescue.


Seriously? Rescue from what? My honesty? Because I was sharing some information that you didn't want to hear?

Look, the reality is that everything that I have stated in my post above does happen. It's a fact. We've all experienced it. I'm not saying that it happens with every single contest, there ARE some good ones as Lonnie has pointed out, but the fact remains, there are more bad ones than good ones.

Here's one for you... I remember a KJ friend of mine telling me about a contest where the judges had already decided on a winner before any contestant even sang a single note!!!!!

I am only trying to be insightful and share what I've seen happen in all my years as a professional KJ and the reason why I hate them so much. If you choose to be naive and discount what I'm saying, so be it. But like it or not, that's the reality of contests.

I wish you the best of luck with yours. I can only hope it is run and judged fairly.


I was being light hearted.


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PostPosted: Sat Apr 07, 2018 10:55 am 
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CruneMeATune wrote:
Back to the opening question:

What I've gleaned, so far, from this thread about that is:
Save the best for last.
And so, I suppose, start with one of your stronger songs; then two other, obviously fabulous but not your most amazing songs; and if you get to the final round, hit them with your most amazing shot. ?

And that, when deciding which song is 'best' audience appeal is king.

You need to relax and stop over analyzing this. It's a karaoke contest! If you are really really talented, then sing your heart out and connect with the audience, and relax.


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PostPosted: Sat Apr 07, 2018 3:00 pm 
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Forget that I personally hate contests. All you really can do is sing your heart out and do the best performance that you have in you. If it's good enough to move you through the process, that is gravy on the turkey. What really matters is how you feel about your performance when you get through singing. Pick songs that move emotions that you know well enough not to have to rely on the screen and have fun.

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PostPosted: Sat Apr 07, 2018 3:40 pm 
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DannyG2006 wrote:
Forget that I personally hate contests. All you really can do is sing your heart out and do the best performance that you have in you. If it's good enough to move you through the process, that is gravy on the turkey. What really matters is how you feel about your performance when you get through singing. Pick songs that move emotions that you know well enough not to have to rely on the screen and have fun.

That was very well spoken, Danny. You stated how you feel about contests, yet you gave her the encouragement to perform her best. I too wish her the best of luck, even though we both know that contests are a farce. Nice job Danny.

By the way... I stated my reasons why I hate contests. Just curious, what are your reasons why you hate them?

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PostPosted: Sat Apr 07, 2018 5:01 pm 
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Alan B wrote:
DannyG2006 wrote:
Forget that I personally hate contests. All you really can do is sing your heart out and do the best performance that you have in you. If it's good enough to move you through the process, that is gravy on the turkey. What really matters is how you feel about your performance when you get through singing. Pick songs that move emotions that you know well enough not to have to rely on the screen and have fun.

That was very well spoken, Danny. You stated how you feel about contests, yet you gave her the encouragement to perform her best. I too wish her the best of luck, even though we both know that contests are a farce. Nice job Danny.

By the way... I stated my reasons why I hate contests. Just curious, what are your reasons why you hate them?

Despite how many people come in for the contest, unless you are that exceptional as a host, they end up coming to the contest nights and then never return unless you have another contest and no matter how fair the contest is, because a lot of the new people who come in are thinking that they are all that and should be the winner, they go away complaining the contest is fixed when they don't win. I have only been to one contest where even I can say that the person who actually won wasn't just a good buddy of the owner or some hot chick that one of the judges wants to go to bed with. And no I didn't win that contest. The one who evetually won the contest was also the one who qualified on the only qualifying night that I could be there. He was that much better than I was. Plus it's not worth alienating some of the regulars who are just there to have fun and sing but all the contest people are cutting into their singing time. I don't mind gaining new regulars but I need to be aware of the regulars as well.

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