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PostPosted: Sun Aug 20, 2017 12:21 am 
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Hey,

**TL;DR near the bottom**
This is my first post on KSM and I'm here because I just got back from DJ'ing karaoke night at my boss's bar (yes, she owns the bar). I've done mobile DJ'ing before, but for KJ'ing, this was only my 2nd show.

The 1st show was fantabulous but there were very few people but those people drank like fish and had an excellent time. I was heaped with praise and everything went smooth, I thought. But, I only had about 9 people in rotation (which was over half the bar).

Then the 2nd show came and. . . holy wtf. I felt totally bombarded constantly. I had about 15-20 people in rotation, only 2 of which left early.

The venue was VERY weird because I was in a cubby area and my speakers were set near the entrance to this large cubby (it was the same size as the rectangled bar but had a 'lip' for a doorway, which really prevented any sound from getting there - it was very hard to hear the true sound level).

I checked my sound levels and everything seemed fine, but given that the volume of each track was widly different throughout the night, it was VERY difficult to not blast the back wall while those closer to the speakers weren't dealing with very loud music. Seriously, there was a spot - about 25% of the way into the rectangled area that all of a sudden amplified the sound as you walked away from the speakers.

So after having to turn all the EQ down on my mic and the volume to almost nothing, that was fixed. Then came the rotation. . .

I had a group of 3 overtake this little old lady who signed up moments before and I put them all at the end of the list (mistake). I ended up skipping Cindi, who would've been 2nd from the last in rotation, so then I started the rotation all over again.

I was singing next (to start the list over) and literally right as my music starts to play, Cindi comes up and says "what happened to me?" and points to her name.

Facepalm moment, face turned beat red, and I apologized quickly and said I would fix it and that I had messed up. Right before singing, I announced that Jack was up next after me. I called Cindi up and had her sing and asked Jack to come up right after.

Jack came to the booth right after, scratched off his name, and said he hated the song I sang and then complained - very drunkenly - that I skipped him "numerous" times. I tried to get him to come back and allow me to explain why I did that and that I had screwed up Cindi's turn but he just kept walking, mumbling the whole way.

At this point, I'm feeling pretty bad because before being a KJ, I HATED feeling like I was skipped so I felt like total dirt. He left. I messaged my boss (the bar owner) and told her what happened and she said he's always a baby --- but still yet. I felt like crap about it.

So then later, I was accused of skipping someone AGAIN! Lisa & Larry signed up together right when they arrived and because I was putting names at the end of the list and proceeding through them (mistake), they ended up singing 2 singers later, but then had to wait quite a long time the next go-round.

But the 2nd song, she wasn't going to sing with Larry. She accused me of skipping her and her husband even came up to me and said I skipped her, but -- without knowing the situation with her name on there 100%, I was confident in saying that I hadn't, because I literally just went down the list, rinsed and repeated.

So after all my diatribe, I want to add this [b]TL;DR:[/b]
1) I skipped someone, bumped them right after me, and ticked another person off for thinking he was skipped (even though he would have waited the same exact amount of time.
2) I learned to NOT add new singers to the bottom of the list and continue going through them after 8 singers or so.
3) I learned to ALWAYS check sound in multiple locations, with the microphone, and to always start a new song at lowered volume in case the 1st track is quiet while 2nd track is booming loud. (She does not have a controller - just a mixer and uses Winamp - ugh)

But my question is: does it happen all the time that drunken people always think they're being skipped just because they've had to wait?

Also, throughout my frustration and feeling of "omg I'm blowing this right now," I didn't do a lot of things I should have done (announcements for upcoming events, etc) -- is there a trick to letting these things go and not feeling the blood rush to my face and feel like I'm horrible at what I'm doing?

Are my concerns/issues normal for a new KJ?

I feel like I learned a LOT tonight because of all the mistakes I felt I made, but to some friends that came to the show, they said they couldn't tell and it seemed like everyone was having a blast --- do you ever feel like that while having people still tell you you're doing a good job?

Sorry for such a huge message but I'm really beating myself up after this show and it's discouraging. It's weird because I've DJ'd 100k weddings before where the people didn't ever need a chair cause the stick up their butts worked fine as a seating arrangement.


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PostPosted: Wed Aug 23, 2017 9:20 am 
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You will eventually learn that once you have 4 or 5 singers, you need to drop out of the list entirely. Patrons that come to sing are not coming to hear you sing or take up what could be a spot for them to shine.

Your job is to orchestrate the party for everyone else, you are not part of it.


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PostPosted: Wed Aug 23, 2017 11:14 am 
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For the volume levels of the songs, give Breakaway Audio Enhancer a try. The background music itself can be set and forget if you use that. Pretty much the only adjustments that I make is on the vocals side.

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PostPosted: Wed Aug 23, 2017 11:23 am 
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I would have put Cindy up in my spot and skipped myself that rotation.


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PostPosted: Wed Aug 23, 2017 1:19 pm 
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Why are you singing in such a large rotation to begin with? I know hosts that do, just feel they shouldn't. You said it's to mark the beginning of the next rotation - well you can just as easily say 'we are back at the top of the rotation' and get the 1st singer up. Personally when I go to karaoke, I do not want to see a host taking up singing time for paying customers. But that's just me. I would have given Cindi my spot and pulled myself out.

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PostPosted: Wed Aug 23, 2017 2:08 pm 
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I haven't run into too many KJs who ever take themselves out of the rotation no matter how many singers there are. They usually got into the business because they enjoy singing so they will use every excuse possible to put themselves into the rotation....especially the one about "someone requested that I sing this song". The better they sing the more they are convinced that people really want to hear them sing alone or in a duet with another singer.


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PostPosted: Wed Aug 23, 2017 2:14 pm 
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I always use a first come first served method of rotation where the singer almost always follow the same singer unless they leave. This way there can be no argument over being skipped. I also run a Marquee listing the singer who is up and the next four singers. If your not one of those listed then you can assume that the singers listed, if it's the very start of the show, put their requests in before you did. I have zero control over where someone gets placed.Just because you saw John submit a request just before you do doesn't mean that you are following John. Someone who has a smartphone might get their request in before you do.
I have only two ways of submitting a request - mobile kiosk or phone app. The mobile kiosk is meant for a person who doesn't have a smartphone.
As to the host singing. I have always sang at the top of the rotation unless I have 8 or more singers, then I pull myself out of the rotation and just announce when the top of the rotation is up. I am starting to just sing the first one to set base levels, we all know that the levels change from singer to singer. Some are loud as heck while others sound like a church mouse.

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PostPosted: Wed Aug 23, 2017 8:53 pm 
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Welcome to my world! lol

you'll learn DJ'ing & KJ'ing are 2 different worlds.

sober regulars are just as bad as drunk regulars, they all think they got skipped. or they go into diva mode (the worst).

if your running paper slips, then you need to adopt the "no slip turned in, then no sing next round" policy. require they turn in a slip every round so there is no confusion.

at my karaoke couples that turn in slips are considered 2 different turns. whichever name is on the slip first is the the pile they get stacked in. if I notice slips coming in with the same persons first, i will ask to verify who's song it is so they don't feel like they were skipped. and depending how busy it is, if they do a duet and it's slammed, then the 1 song counts as both of their turn. usually not an issue, i'd have to have 30+ singers before i did that. If it's slow then I let each get a turn doing a duet, so that's 2 songs in a row with the same singer, but I also make sure I anounce that it's the 2nd persons turn to sing their song so people don't think I'm letting them just do 2 in a row.

the last is probably the most argued point between different host's, you will learn your singers and they will do what you stay consistent with. no one way is the right way!

and you need to stick to your guns! don't let the singers tell you how it's done, it's your show, run it your way! own it, make it yours!

i sing every rotation until i hit about 15+ singers then I drop out. unless I have a group that asks me to sing again (my Elks Lodge night, i get yelled at if i take myself out of the rotation. so i sing all night long with them.)

and personally if you can talk the owner into some real karaoke hosting software that has rotation management you will better off and skip a lot less people.

Karafun is a free karaoke software that has rotation management. you don't have to subscribe to their service to use the program, it will let you import your current music you already have. I'm assuming your digital because you said you use winamp for karaoke.

some of the paid karaoke programs can estimate times when singer will sing again and keep track of how many time someone has sang and the time the signed up. so there is no question whether you skipped someone or not. only way to make a mistake is if you forgot to add them to the list or manually screwed up the rotation by accidentally changing the rotation order.

remember to have fun and keep it fun, don't turn it into a job.

If you have any questions, just ask! we love to answer questions. and give us time to answer, some of us work real jobs in the daytime and run karaoke at night so sometimes it takes a day or so before get an answer.

other hosts will argue a lot of these points and agree with others, but like i said we all have our own way of running karaoke that works for us. and what works here in my area, may not work in yours.

good luck!

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PostPosted: Thu Aug 24, 2017 1:48 am 
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Karaoke Croaker wrote:
I haven't run into too many KJs who ever take themselves out of the rotation no matter how many singers there are. They usually got into the business because they enjoy singing so they will use every excuse possible to put themselves into the rotation....especially the one about "someone requested that I sing this song". The better they sing the more they are convinced that people really want to hear them sing alone or in a duet with another singer.
This was ONE reason I got into hosting because of hosts that felt they needed to sing every round - and sometimes more especially after other good singers. Never thought it was fair & made sure I pulled myself out after 5 or so singers only to sing on a rare request or to help out a duet on their turn if needed. Getting into the business of hosting just to sing is and always has been the wrong reason!

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PostPosted: Thu Aug 24, 2017 1:51 am 
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No KJ should sing, period! Your job is to "HOST", not to sing. It's about the people who came out to sing, not about you. I don't care if you have 3 singers or 30 singers. If you want to sing, go to someone else's show when your not working and sing all you want.

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PostPosted: Thu Aug 24, 2017 3:02 am 
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Alan B wrote:
No KJ should sing, period! Your job is to "HOST", not to sing. It's about the people who came out to sing, not about you. I don't care if you have 3 singers or 30 singers. If you want to sing, go to someone else's show when your not working and sing all you want.

opinionated much?

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PostPosted: Thu Aug 24, 2017 4:53 am 
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mightywiz wrote:
Welcome to my world! lol

you'll learn DJ'ing & KJ'ing are 2 different worlds.

sober regulars are just as bad as drunk regulars, they all think they got skipped. or they go into diva mode (the worst).

if your running paper slips, then you need to adopt the "no slip turned in, then no sing next round" policy. require they turn in a slip every round so there is no confusion.

at my karaoke couples that turn in slips are considered 2 different turns. whichever name is on the slip first is the the pile they get stacked in. if I notice slips coming in with the same persons first, i will ask to verify who's song it is so they don't feel like they were skipped. and depending how busy it is, if they do a duet and it's slammed, then the 1 song counts as both of their turn. usually not an issue, i'd have to have 30+ singers before i did that. If it's slow then I let each get a turn doing a duet, so that's 2 songs in a row with the same singer, but I also make sure I anounce that it's the 2nd persons turn to sing their song so people don't think I'm letting them just do 2 in a row.

the last is probably the most argued point between different host's, you will learn your singers and they will do what you stay consistent with. no one way is the right way!

and you need to stick to your guns! don't let the singers tell you how it's done, it's your show, run it your way! own it, make it yours!

i sing every rotation until i hit about 15+ singers then I drop out. unless I have a group that asks me to sing again (my Elks Lodge night, i get yelled at if i take myself out of the rotation. so i sing all night long with them.)

and personally if you can talk the owner into some real karaoke hosting software that has rotation management you will better off and skip a lot less people.

Karafun is a free karaoke software that has rotation management. you don't have to subscribe to their service to use the program, it will let you import your current music you already have. I'm assuming your digital because you said you use winamp for karaoke.

some of the paid karaoke programs can estimate times when singer will sing again and keep track of how many time someone has sang and the time the signed up. so there is no question whether you skipped someone or not. only way to make a mistake is if you forgot to add them to the list or manually screwed up the rotation by accidentally changing the rotation order.

remember to have fun and keep it fun, don't turn it into a job.

If you have any questions, just ask! we love to answer questions. and give us time to answer, some of us work real jobs in the daytime and run karaoke at night so sometimes it takes a day or so before get an answer.

other hosts will argue a lot of these points and agree with others, but like i said we all have our own way of running karaoke that works for us. and what works here in my area, may not work in yours.

good luck!

I beg to differ on KaraFun having rotation management. It is totally a playlist software. If AutoKDJ was still available, technically you can get version 1 if you Google it, then all you have to do is install it into winamp. the request area is in the media library of winamp, no ugly frontend like Sax & Dotties or RoxBox.

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PostPosted: Thu Aug 24, 2017 4:58 am 
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Alan B wrote:
No KJ should sing, period! Your job is to "HOST", not to sing. It's about the people who came out to sing, not about you. I don't care if you have 3 singers or 30 singers. If you want to sing, go to someone else's show when your not working and sing all you want.

So you want your first singer to be your guinea pig, not knowing if they are going to sound good at the start of the song? I always sing the first song as a sound check so that I can make even the first requester sound good from the first note.

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PostPosted: Thu Aug 24, 2017 5:24 am 
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DannyG2006 wrote:
Alan B wrote:
No KJ should sing, period! Your job is to "HOST", not to sing. It's about the people who came out to sing, not about you. I don't care if you have 3 singers or 30 singers. If you want to sing, go to someone else's show when your not working and sing all you want.

So you want your first singer to be your guinea pig, not knowing if they are going to sound good at the start of the song? I always sing the first song as a sound check so that I can make even the first requester sound good from the first note.

I do a sound check after I set up. I don't need to sing the first song. My first singer will sound just as good as my last. Nice try Danny but trying to justify singing the first song in order to make sure that everything is OK for your singers is just not gonna cut it with me. I make sure that all my singers from my first to my last sound awesome. And that's without me ever singing the first song.

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Last edited by Alan B on Thu Aug 24, 2017 5:35 am, edited 1 time in total.

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PostPosted: Thu Aug 24, 2017 5:33 am 
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Paradigm Karaoke wrote:
Alan B wrote:
No KJ should sing, period! Your job is to "HOST", not to sing. It's about the people who came out to sing, not about you. I don't care if you have 3 singers or 30 singers. If you want to sing, go to someone else's show when your not working and sing all you want.

opinionated much?

Not really. More like a fact, not an opinion.

Fact: A KJ is getting paid to host a show NOT be part of it.

Fact: A KJ's job is to accommodate his singers, NOT himself.

Look, I know that a lot of KJ's include themselves into the rotation regardless of the amount of singers that they have. I think that this is wrong. You are taking a spot away from someone else and that's not right, or fair.

If I go out to sing karaoke, I want to sing... not listen to the KJ's sorry azz sing no matter how good he is.

There is no reason in hell why the KJ should include himself in the rotation, or even sing the first song. It's total BS. Once again, it's not about YOU, it's about THEM.

Like Lonnie, it was also one of the reasons why I got into hosting. Because most of the KJ's totally sucked. They were nothing more than name callers. Had no people skills, and the personality of a flea. Yet, they made it about themselves, not about their customers.

I turned that around, and my following has proven that.

So, my fellow KJ's, take my advice and make it about your singers. That means that you do NOT sing.

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PostPosted: Thu Aug 24, 2017 6:17 am 
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I time finishing my setup to start time. So I don't have time for a separate sound check. I tried a separate sound check but got flack for doing the sound check and waiting for start time to officially start the show. I for one do not want to hear any complaints. I also use my singing the first song as a teaching tool for those who are unfamiliar with how karaoke works. I know that in this day and age most already know but you would be surprised how many ask about how do I know what to sing and when to sing. So it's still all about my singers.

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PostPosted: Thu Aug 24, 2017 6:39 am 
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DannyG2006 wrote:
I know that in this day and age most already know but you would be surprised how many ask about how do I know what to sing and when to sing. So it's still all about my singers.

You keep telling yourself that. :D

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PostPosted: Thu Aug 24, 2017 7:05 am 
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Let's look at it this way, there's no dead air between the sound check and the start of the show. I know as a singer, I would be pissed off to have to wait several minutes for a show to begin after the host pretty much proved that his system was good to go and would be the first to comment on it. Sorry but your rule of the host not singing doesn't fly for me. One question, what happens when you get a request for a duet from someone who can't get another singer to give up their spot so that the person who is wanting to do a duet? My answer is that if I know the duet, I will gladly help that singer out.

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PostPosted: Thu Aug 24, 2017 7:12 am 
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DannyG2006 wrote:
Let's look at it this way, there's no dead air between the sound check and the start of the show. I know as a singer, I would be pissed off to have to wait several minutes for a show to begin after the host pretty much proved that his system was good to go and would be the first to comment on it. Sorry but your rule of the host not singing doesn't fly for me. One question, what happens when you get a request for a duet from someone who can't get another singer to give up their spot so that the person who is wanting to do a duet?

First of all, I always arrive at all my venues early with at least an hour of free time to make sure everything is sounding good before my show starts. If my show starts at 8, than I'm ready to go by 7. That gives me enough time to have something to eat before the show starts.

As far as singing with someone... If someone asks me to sing a duet with them, I will do it. I am not taking up a spot by doing so. It's still their turn and they can do anything they like with it.

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PostPosted: Thu Aug 24, 2017 7:21 am 
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8) To sing or not to sing that is the question? The trouble is there are no firm answers, just like how the rotation should be run. Whatever you decide to do the main thing is to be consistent and don't bend anyway the wind blows. I have always favored the strict rotation with no inserts. If you miss the beginning you have to wait until the wheel comes round again. To me that is fair to the patrons who have been waiting patiently until their next turn, all the time spending money at the venue. As far a singing goes I would actually prefer not to sing when operating the equipment, since I like to focus on one or the other. Sometimes I was asked to do duets and of course I did. When patrons asked why I didn't sing more I told them if I wanted to give a personal concert I would have sold tickets, that they were the show not me.

P.S. Sometimes hosts are just too hard on themselves, after all they are being asked to do a job which they had to learn on their own. There is no book to tell you how do set up your show, no school you can attend. Having a night where something doesn't work is far more common, than having a night with no problems. Just like the old Chinese proverb "Man without problems is like Dog without fleas". The sign of the true professional is how you deal with the problems. Since the average gig lasts less than a year, anytime you play longer at one venue indicates that you are doing something right. You are always going to have someone who feels they got the short end of the stick, you can't let it bother you.


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