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KaraokeIan
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 Posted: Mon Jan 09, 2017 6:46 pm |
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chrisavis wrote:
Unfortunately, you are wrong.
I will be happy to post the entirety of my exchange with Bob for everyone to see where I asked a simple question and - *without warning* - was insulted.
None of us are special. You just haven't pissed off Bob yet. It may never happen and you may be able to defend him indefinitely (just as I did). But if the day comes that he does bite your head off, I would like to see how you actually respond to it. Especially if you have >$1000 invested in his software *and* knowing he has rescinded licenses on people in the past.
How am I going to piss him off? I only ask questions or throw in an idea here and there. What is there to get pissed about? Every transcript of conversations I've seen with him, the customer always does something I wouldn't do. They always can't take a hint and force him to be blunt or they just say something really stupid. Neither of which I worry about. For starters, all contact with him is through email or messaging, which means you have all the time in the world to think about what you're going to say before you say it. Well, put your money where your mouth is. You did say you'd "gladly" post it. Let us see this "without warning" insult. If it was indeed an insult, then you fall into the second category where you just said something stupid, which I find hard to believe, because you used to answer user questions in their forum back when it existed, and Bob actually talked you up back then. If YOU said something that he thought was stupid, I have to see it.
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SINGA USA
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Posted: Mon Jan 09, 2017 8:51 pm |
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Quote: Well in my opinion it's several factors.
1. Karaoke version is more established by the simple virtue that they have been around longer. Karaoke.net may be backed by KSF which is international, but the website has only been up for less than a year
As a corrilary, karaoke.net has a huge back catalog that they are trying to legally put up while at the same time trying to balance making new music that takes both time and huge amounts of money.
Karaoke version has no such restrictions. There enire back catalog is already paid for and licenced, which means they can focus the majority of their resources on new production.
2. Licensing in the US & Canada is a pain in the arse process that takes more resources, time and money and until the laws catch up, that's the way it's going to be
3. Since karaoke.net was designed to be a US licensed site, it may not have as wide a user base as Karaoke Version.
-James An accurate description of the situation. KV has added lots of predominately French songs recently which I believe they are distributing for another supplier. 2017 will be a big year for Sybersound/KSF as we are introducing new products and services. But most importantly, we are employing various new strategies to speed the clearance/release of both new and back catalog which is really what everyone here cares about the most. Thanks for the lists Lonnie.
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KaraokeIan
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Posted: Tue Jan 10, 2017 9:07 am |
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chrisavis wrote: How are my vocalizations any different than 10 years of anti-SC rhetoric? But you are tired of my complaining about Bob? Which, contrary to your claim, has only been going on infrequently for less than a year.
I am helping the karaoke community by warning them about how Bob treats his customers. I would rather not see someone invest in his products without knowing they might end up on Bob's bad side for no legitimate reason other than Bob was having a bad day when you sent him a simple tech support question. How is this different than your anti-SC stuff? For starters, discussions about SC are always about their company policies, which are things that effect every customer. Discussions about Karaosoft seem to shift off topic to how Bob talked to YOU. When you say you're warning people about how he treats his customers, you're implying that he gets offensive to everyone, and every time, as if it's the default. In their 10 years in business, I've seen only half a dozen of complaints about this. That's less than one a year. They've got thousands of customers, so that's like a fraction of a percent, and to flat out say that is how all customers are treated is quite a leap. It's beyond a leap. You yourself admitted you had plenty of conversations with Bob before he said something you didn't like, so you're contradicting yourself. Speaking of contradicting yourself, where is this conversation you promised to post? I can only conclude that you went back and reread it, and realized that you did indeed say something at least somewhat stupid. Not that it warrants whatever response Bob gave you, but that in fact there is some basis in his reply, and let's be honest, that's the part you don't want us to see. You're like the drunk who got kicked out of the bar, and you're trying to convince everyone that it's the bar owner's fault and that he treats everyone that way. Well, I've been going to that bar for over a decade now, and they're still in business and I still go there, and so do thousands of others. Chris its time to accept that you're the exception, and not the rule. You've been very helpful on this forum when it comes to computer questions, but just like Bob and most computer people, your social skills aren't what you think they are. My guess is your confrontation with bob was nothing more than 2 computer geeks having a dick measuring contest, which, contrary to your belief, doesn't affect the rest of us at all, and frankly we don't care. This thread was not about your personal vendettas, but just like many other threads, you felt the need to inject it anyway. Start an anti-bob thread and have a field day, but stop hijacking other threads and assuming everyone cares about your off topic concerns. It's getting old. The more you need to say the same thing over and over, the less effective it gets each time. If bob telling off a customer was something that actually had the power to bring his company down, it would have happened long ago. As with most computer geeks, you're really overestimating the power you have in the real world. You're not Donald Trump and this isn't Twitter. Come back to reality. Now can we get back to the topic at hand? I'd like to hear your opinion on this French company that seems to be taking over the throne as global king of karaoke production. Does this bother you in any way? Do you have any opinions on a solution? Do you think Mr. Trump can make American karaoke great again with better legislation? These are the things I'd like to know. This is why I started this thread.
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mrmarog
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Posted: Tue Jan 10, 2017 9:23 am |
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KaraokeIan wrote: He's changed a license name for me once, but did let me know not to take it for granted in the future. I later came to "see the light" with respect to the license name really not being that relevant because it's not. They like license names to be traceable to the original credit card holder and I get that. I also get that asking to change the name is asking someone to go out of their way, and sometimes in life, people don't have the time to go out of their way for you, and if they don't, they surely don't owe you an apology because they didn't have time to do something for you. I made a public apology in 2013 here viewtopic.php?f=33&t=27974&p=362826&hilit=flawless#p362826. So I guess I'm the bigger man because I sure didn't have to.  I've read enough conversations with Bob to know that I'm sure there was a point where he politely told you that he wasn't going to do it, and then there was a point where you acted like he should, and that's when he told you to F off, when in fact, you should have got the hint the first time. There was never a "warning" made to me, but I'd heard several warnings expressed by others. They are virtually all the same. If you feel it went differently, than please post the conversation and let us decide for ourselves. Oh yeah and let him use that against me...... sure!It still doesn't change the fact you asked him to go out of his way for you and your real anger is that he didn't. Whether he turned you down politely or impolitely isn't really what matters, is it? You feel he owed you something. He does owe me something. I bought a product (for someone else) and I needed a little help making it happen (emphasis on little) It's rather evident in your remark that he now owes you an apology, and you feel that he will truly "see the light" when he understands that mrmarog SHOULD be catered to. I think it's clear who the self centered person is in this equation. Bob is clearly an ego maniac to the extreme. I have never had any business that I have purchased something from treat me like Bob has treated me or so many other paying customersmrmarog, let me ask you this. In all those times that you previously communicated with Bob, and he took his time to answer your questions or take your suggestions, how many times did you go out of your way for him? I'm guessing none. I convinced no less than 10 people to buy Karma licences over the last 4 years. Some have more than 1 licences and may also own KJFM, and other Karaosoft products. One of these people had their Karma license revoked as a result of a very minor discussion. So is that doing something for him? BTW I posted a list of those customers, which where all purchased from my IP address. Where does your logic conclude that he owes you any out of the ordinary favors? ...or any favors for that matter? Or by favors do you mean I should offer to fix his fence or mow his lawn? He's not your friend and isn't supposed to be. When you buy a license for software, that's what you're buying. You get support and questions answered, but to think that your money also purchased his friendship and out of the ordinary favors is rather delusional. Sure you can hide this delusion by pointing the finger at the person who didn't cater to you, but what does that say about you? With friends like him who needs enemies. When I purchase a product I expect a good product, which I received, and software support, which I sometimes received. What I did not purchase or expect, was to be insulted. To those of us who know that Bob is only selectively offensive to people (as we all are), we've only seen evidence that his attitude goes south when people have these delusional expectations of him owing them more than just the license and support they paid for. When Karma first rolled out in 2008 I spent dozens if not hundreds of hours debugging and making suggestions. There is little doubt that Bob knows who I am. I was extremely patient through that entire time frame when a majority of users were experiencing "freezes" and "lock ups" due to an over taxing video engine. I kept the program andcontinued to run my show with it in spite of needing to reboot at least once a night. In the real early days if you had to force reboot you would loose everything and come back to an empty Karma slate. I did my due diligence. Meanwhile, those of us who are respectful of his time seem to have no problems with him. Now, explain to me what it is about you that is so special? I'd really like to know. Are you implying that those of us who respect his time are somehow weak people who aren't getting all we can out of someone? Respect is earned!
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chrisavis
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Posted: Tue Jan 10, 2017 9:52 am |
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KaraokeIan wrote: chrisavis wrote: How are my vocalizations any different than 10 years of anti-SC rhetoric? But you are tired of my complaining about Bob? Which, contrary to your claim, has only been going on infrequently for less than a year.
I am helping the karaoke community by warning them about how Bob treats his customers. I would rather not see someone invest in his products without knowing they might end up on Bob's bad side for no legitimate reason other than Bob was having a bad day when you sent him a simple tech support question. How is this different than your anti-SC stuff? For starters, discussions about SC are always about their company policies, which are things that effect every customer. Discussions about Karaosoft seem to shift off topic to how Bob talked to YOU. When you say you're warning people about how he treats his customers, you're implying that he gets offensive to everyone, and every time, as if it's the default. In their 10 years in business, I've seen only half a dozen of complaints about this. That's less than one a year. They've got thousands of customers, so that's like a fraction of a percent, and to flat out say that is how all customers are treated is quite a leap. It's beyond a leap. You yourself admitted you had plenty of conversations with Bob before he said something you didn't like, so you're contradicting yourself. Speaking of contradicting yourself, where is this conversation you promised to post? I can only conclude that you went back and reread it, and realized that you did indeed say something at least somewhat stupid. Not that it warrants whatever response Bob gave you, but that in fact there is some basis in his reply, and let's be honest, that's the part you don't want us to see. You're like the drunk who got kicked out of the bar, and you're trying to convince everyone that it's the bar owner's fault and that he treats everyone that way. Well, I've been going to that bar for over a decade now, and they're still in business and I still go there, and so do thousands of others. Chris its time to accept that you're the exception, and not the rule. You've been very helpful on this forum when it comes to computer questions, but just like Bob and most computer people, your social skills aren't what you think they are. My guess is your confrontation with bob was nothing more than 2 computer geeks having a dick measuring contest, which, contrary to your belief, doesn't affect the rest of us at all, and frankly we don't care. This thread was not about your personal vendettas, but just like many other threads, you felt the need to inject it anyway. Start an anti-bob thread and have a field day, but stop hijacking other threads and assuming everyone cares about your off topic concerns. It's getting old. The more you need to say the same thing over and over, the less effective it gets each time. If bob telling off a customer was something that actually had the power to bring his company down, it would have happened long ago. As with most computer geeks, you're really overestimating the power you have in the real world. You're not Donald Trump and this isn't Twitter. Come back to reality. Now can we get back to the topic at hand? I'd like to hear your opinion on this French company that seems to be taking over the throne as global king of karaoke production. Does this bother you in any way? Do you have any opinions on a solution? Do you think Mr. Trump can make American karaoke great again with better legislation? These are the things I'd like to know. This is why I started this thread. First of all, *this* is the reason why people compare you to Bob. You have no real reason to go off on me, yet you are. It may only be a 1/2 dozen complaints that YOU have seen, but they didn't actually happen to you. If it ever does, then let's revisit your position. I did go back an re-read the conversation between Bob and I. Mostly to ensure there were no private matters being discussed. I will post the thread in it's entirety once I have ensured there is no private or confidential information being discussed. Bob may be a dick, but I still respect confidential and private information in conversations. Regardless, I am not on your schedule. If you think you can force my hand, then you don't know me very well. My opinion of Karaoke Version is pretty well known. They are my go to source. They are quick to release new hits, and unlike a certain small time karaoke software producer, they have never, to the best of my knowledge, belittled any customer of theirs (and I am pretty sure they have exponentially more). You asked, so......I think Trump is a douchebag and is only in this for his ego and to make money. He has never had to want for anything in his life and has no connection to the people that voted for him.
_________________
-Chris
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KaraokeIan
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Posted: Tue Jan 10, 2017 5:17 pm |
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chrisavis wrote: First of all, *this* is the reason why people compare you to Bob. You have no real reason to go off on me, yet you are. This is exactly why I go off on you. It's because you act like some kind of victim. Where I come from, boys like you are teased until their skin thickens up a bit. That's part of growing up and becoming a man. At least in east coast cities. Bob and I are both from Baltimore but this is a pretty common thing up and down the mid Atlantic cities. New York is famous for it. This isn't high school and no one is threatening to beat you up after school. You're a grown man acting like a victim over mere words said to you. In this town, that makes you a sissy and I'm calling you out on it as I would any other grown man. I guess Bob sensed the same thing and I guess that's why you think we're alike. Not every computer geek is shy and meek so stop expecting them to be. Some are like New York taxi drivers. Also, its not that we just go off on everyone and acting like bullies all the time. By default, we are polite adults like everyone else, but when it comes time to argue, let's just say we don't hold back, and more importantly, we're not afraid to. This is the part you don't like and try to portray as abnormal. If you want to live in your bubble and pretend that everyone is expected to be nice to you, that's ok, but the moment you publicly act like a victim is the moment you gave up those rights and open yourself up for criticism. This is where you need to ask yourself why words bother you at your age. I'm also offended as a user on this forum why you need to "warn" people that they might hear words they don't want to. Some people like honesty and aren't afraid of it. Who are you to speak for everyone and assume every other man is as emotionally weak as you are? Some of us can actually handle it and find it perfectly normal. Did that ever occur to you?
Let me ask you this. If your own father saw this conversation, what would he say? Would he say "Gee Chris that man was awfully mean to you, lets go home" or would he say "grow a pair and act like a man"? We both know the answer and all I have to say is that we were just raised differently. Everyone is raised differently, so stop treating everyone else on this forum like we can't handle a conversation that may contain brutal honesty. Others CAN handle it. We don't need your child warning labels. You talk to potential Karaosoft customers like they might fall off a cliff and die. WARNING: Dangerous Words may happen! How are you perceiving peoples thoughts on this? Do you honestly think that everyone who reads your warnings are thinking "Oh my God, Thank you Chris. I don't know what we would do without you protecting us from offensive comments." Maybe it's the dad in you that perceives the real world as an R rated movie and the rest of us are your children that need to be shielded from it. Whatever it is, it's pathetic in my opinion. It may only be a 1/2 dozen complaints that YOU have seen, but they didn't actually happen to you. If it ever does, then let's revisit your position. Again, I can handle being chewed out by anyone, and even if it did happen and I were trying to play the victim card like yourself, I would at least post the conversation to back up my argument that its Bob's fault. You know darn well you said SOMETHING stupid to piss him off and this is why you're only sharing your side of this supposed argument. I did go back an re-read the conversation between Bob and I. Mostly to ensure there were no private matters being discussed. I will post the thread in it's entirety once I have ensured there is no private or confidential information being discussed. Bob may be a dick, but I still respect confidential and private information in conversations. Really? You're ok with publicly slandering someone but when it comes time to show proof, suddenly you're worried about laws and ethics? Once again, you're contradicting your own behavior.Regardless, I am not on your schedule. If you think you can force my hand, then you don't know me very well. Well I know you're never going to show us that conversation and that you're about as emotionally weak as ten year old, so I do know a few things about you. I also sense some toughness in that first sentence. Where was that when you were talking to Bob?My opinion of Karaoke Version is pretty well known. They are my go to source. They are quick to release new hits, and unlike a certain small time karaoke software producer, they have never, to the best of my knowledge, belittled any customer of theirs (and I am pretty sure they have exponentially more). I'm sure they do have exponentially more customers, which, ironically, is why you can't even begin to know how each and every one has been treated. I know your rosy view of the world would like to believe that they have a 100% being nice to everyone record, but that's not true for any large company. There are individuals who are nice to everyone and rarely say a cross word, so this could only be close to true in a small company like Bob's where that one person was always nice, but as soon as you have employees that are just working for a paycheck, you'd be surprised how fast that goes out the window. All companies have some disgruntled customers and some disgruntled employees too. Arguments are inevitable everywhere.
Once again, I noticed you playing the victim card when you used the word "belittled". Emotionally mature people CAN'T be belittled. If anyone ever made you feel "belittled", that's on you, not them. By using these words, I don't think you realize it, but you're once again proving that you can't handle words and admitting that they hurt you. Even KNF, who many have "belittled" on this forum (for tons of stupid comments) doesn't play the victim card much as you, and she's a girl!!!!
You asked, so......I think Trump is a douchebag and is only in this for his ego and to make money. He has never had to want for anything in his life and has no connection to the people that voted for him. Totally agree. The man has very few good qualities at all and is so unqualified for the job. I could go on and on but its too late for debates. We're all just kinda stuck with this one. Donald Trump does have one quality I admire, and it's the one you don't. It's called balls. Just like me and Bob, Donald is from an east coast city and he too would tell you to grow a pair 
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Cueball
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Posted: Tue Jan 10, 2017 6:16 pm |
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KaraokeIan wrote: I guess Bob sensed the same thing and I guess that's why you think we're alike. I thought you ARE Bob. Maybe I was wrong, but, thou dost protest too much!
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KaraokeIan
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Posted: Tue Jan 10, 2017 6:19 pm |
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mrmarog wrote: KaraokeIan wrote: He's changed a license name for me once, but did let me know not to take it for granted in the future. I later came to "see the light" with respect to the license name really not being that relevant because it's not. They like license names to be traceable to the original credit card holder and I get that. I also get that asking to change the name is asking someone to go out of their way, and sometimes in life, people don't have the time to go out of their way for you, and if they don't, they surely don't owe you an apology because they didn't have time to do something for you. I made a public apology in 2013 here viewtopic.php?f=33&t=27974&p=362826&hilit=flawless#p362826. So I guess I'm the bigger man because I sure didn't have to. ...and you assumed Bob saw this? I've never seen him on this board or any other except the short lived forum Karaosoft had at one time. You didn't make that to him, you made it for the forum users. I've read enough conversations with Bob to know that I'm sure there was a point where he politely told you that he wasn't going to do it, and then there was a point where you acted like he should, and that's when he told you to F off, when in fact, you should have got the hint the first time. There was never a "warning" made to me, but I'd heard several warnings expressed by others.You're not paying attention. In your conversation with Bob, I said that just like others I've seen, there was probably a point where he told you he wasn't going to do you this favor, and yes, that was the sign that you weren't going to get your way. THAT was the warning. They are virtually all the same. If you feel it went differently, than please post the conversation and let us decide for ourselves. Oh yeah and let him use that against me...... sure!Really? Even if Bob did read these forums or had someone reporting them to him, there's quite a few people he could use their words against them. No one has ever claimed that he's retaliated over anything not said directly to him. I think you're overestimating his concerns and what he does with his spare time.It still doesn't change the fact you asked him to go out of his way for you and your real anger is that he didn't. Whether he turned you down politely or impolitely isn't really what matters, is it? You feel he owed you something. He does owe me something. I bought a product (for someone else) and I needed a little help making it happen (emphasis on little)Like I said, their web site is like a vending machine. If you walked up to a coke machine and couldn't figure out how to use it, does the coca cola company have the responsibility to send someone out to show you how to put your quarter in? Oh that's right, in your scenario, you wanted them to come out and change the name on the can just for you. I think your idea of what companies owe you is a little overboard. It's rather evident in your remark that he now owes you an apology, and you feel that he will truly "see the light" when he understands that mrmarog SHOULD be catered to. I think it's clear who the self centered person is in this equation. Bob is clearly an ego maniac to the extreme. I have never had any business that I have purchased something from treat me like Bob has treated me or so many other paying customers Would you like a tissue? Maybe if you share the words that he hurt you with, it will make you feel better. It's ok. You're in a safe place. There there. Don't worry, people like Chris will help protect us in the future, so gentle flowers like yourself won't have to be exposed to such absolute horrors. I'm appalled. Will someone get this man a tissue?mrmarog, let me ask you this. In all those times that you previously communicated with Bob, and he took his time to answer your questions or take your suggestions, how many times did you go out of your way for him? I'm guessing none. I convinced no less than 10 people to buy Karma licences over the last 4 years. Some have more than 1 licences and may also own KJFM, and other Karaosoft products. One of these people had their Karma license revoked as a result of a very minor discussion. So is that doing something for him? BTW I posted a list of those customers, which where all purchased from my IP address. Ok, back to being serious. woh woh woh. How is this a favor to bob? Did he ask you to do this? You did this to impress your friends and turn them on to some software that they'd find useful. Do you honestly expect anyone reading this to believe that you pushed this software on your friends all as a favor to Bob? Really? Where does your logic conclude that he owes you any out of the ordinary favors? ...or any favors for that matter? Or by favors do you mean I should offer to fix his fence or mow his lawn? It was about him owing you favors. Not the other way around. Once again, you're not paying attention. I'm starting to see how you could possibly wear Bob's patience down. I'm not even done reading your remarks and you've already not paid attention twice. You're starting to piss me off too. Were you this difficult with your parents growing up? If you have dyslexia or something uncontrollable that causes this, I apologize, but you should have disclosed that early on.
He's not your friend and isn't supposed to be. When you buy a license for software, that's what you're buying. You get support and questions answered, but to think that your money also purchased his friendship and out of the ordinary favors is rather delusional. Sure you can hide this delusion by pointing the finger at the person who didn't cater to you, but what does that say about you? With friends like him who needs enemies. When I purchase a product I expect a good product, which I received, and software support, which I sometimes received. What I did not purchase or expect, was to be insulted. Once again, we have a forum user who can criticize everything under the sun everyday on a forum, but somehow hasn't developed an immunity to criticism himself. If this is true, then you need to learn an old saying. "People who live in glass houses shouldn't throw stones." I'm not saying you shouldn't throw stones, I'm saying get out of the glass house or build a better outer wall. This is not literal, but a lesson about emotional maturity. I felt the need to clarify that with your previous confusions. To those of us who know that Bob is only selectively offensive to people (as we all are), we've only seen evidence that his attitude goes south when people have these delusional expectations of him owing them more than just the license and support they paid for. When Karma first rolled out in 2008 I spent dozens if not hundreds of hours debugging and making suggestions. There is little doubt that Bob knows who I am. I was extremely patient through that entire time frame when a majority of users were experiencing "freezes" and "lock ups" due to an over taxing video engine. I kept the program andcontinued to run my show with it in spite of needing to reboot at least once a night. In the real early days if you had to force reboot you would loose everything and come back to an empty Karma slate. I did my due diligence. So What? I've owned every model iPhone since they first came out, and if Steve Jobs were still alive, I surely don't think he owes me anything. Once again, you're confusing things you've done for yourself with what a company owes you.Meanwhile, those of us who are respectful of his time seem to have no problems with him. Now, explain to me what it is about you that is so special? I'd really like to know. Are you implying that those of us who respect his time are somehow weak people who aren't getting all we can out of someone? Respect is earned!Exactly, but it is NOT bought. This is where you're confused.
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Lonman
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Posted: Tue Jan 10, 2017 6:33 pm |
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cueball wrote: KaraokeIan wrote: I guess Bob sensed the same thing and I guess that's why you think we're alike. I thought you ARE Bob...... He is, he said so himself, must have forgotten! KaraokeIan wrote: Of course I'm Bob. Lonman figured that out years ago. viewtopic.php?f=1&t=35472&start=20#p417022_________________ LIKE Lonman on Facebook - Lonman Productions Karaoke & my main site via my profile!
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KaraokeIan
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Posted: Wed Jan 11, 2017 6:08 am |
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Lonman wrote: cueball wrote: KaraokeIan wrote: I guess Bob sensed the same thing and I guess that's why you think we're alike. I thought you ARE Bob...... He is, he said so himself, must have forgotten! KaraokeIan wrote: Of course I'm Bob. Lonman figured that out years ago. viewtopic.php?f=1&t=35472&start=20#p417022Lonnie, you really need to work on sensing sarcasm.
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mrmarog
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Posted: Wed Jan 11, 2017 7:17 am |
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Karaokelan, You are acting like Bob/you is/are the victim. Now who is sensitive. BTW I have a dog that can way out-piss you any day and he only weighs 12 pounds. So if you're pissed off ...get in line. Bob (went by bobble in the early days) had a presence on this forum. He/you used it as a free promotional tool to advertise his/your products. I am quite sure that he/you are still quite aware of what is written about him/you and his/your products even if he/you say/says he/you isn't/aren't. In one of my emails I sent Bob he replied that he would start helping me when I stopped bashing Karma. That response was because of a thread I started entitled "Karma locks up once a night on my laptop" see here: viewtopic.php?f=33&t=19585&hilit=karma&start=40 This thread was beacause I was hoping that someone might have an answer that Bob had not thought of. I never once bashed Karma In that thread I re-posted a message I received from Bob: "Now I know I've had this conversation with you before so this is going to sound like I'm repeating myself but the fact remains that the facts haven't changed. Karma is a resource hog and its caused by the amount of third party components it uses.ALL of the lockups and freezing issues are mainly from older machines and underpowered laptops. Those problems will always exist until people follow all of the recommendations and/or run it on sufficient hardware."My response was: My laptop is an MSI, 17", gamer, i5 Intel, with independent video processor. I am sure that a i7 would do the trick because my desktop is an i7 and it runs at only 7% cpu in dual video. and then I posted a photo showing my set-up with a cooler. Here is more correspondence:
> From: support@latshawsystems.com
> To: mrmarog
> Subject: RE: From LS WEBSITE: Product Suggestion
> Date: Mon, 12 Sep 2011 11:22:57 -0400
>
> I'll make you a deal. You stop trashing us on public forums, and we'll
> start listening to you. Fair enough?
From: Roger
Sent: Monday, September 12, 2011 1:33 PM
To: Latshaw Tech Support
Subject: RE: From LS WEBSITE: Product Suggestion
Hi Bob, You have a deal. I wouldn't exactly call my posts trashing, I made a couple of statements about it being a resource hog (and yes it is), but I tried to tell others what I did to fix the problem. There was a time, a while back, that you never responded to my emails that i sent to you, that tends to reduce my enthusiasm. I have never said that your support is terrible or that your products are terrible. I have always been a strong supporter of all your products. The reason I started the thread, that you must be referring to, was to get feedback from others about their experiences. Advances in technology don't happen without feedback. Problems don't get solved without discussing them. I believe that I have always discussed my problems (with you first), and have never trashed your product. Let's work together and make this the greatest karaoke hosting program on the planet.
Peace,
Roger
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Lonman
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Posted: Wed Jan 11, 2017 10:23 am |
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Joined: Mon Dec 10, 2001 3:57 pm
Posts: 22975
Songs: 35
Images: 3
Location: Tacoma, WA
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mrmarog wrote: Bob (went by bobble in the early days) had a presence on this forum. BINGO!_________________ LIKE Lonman on Facebook - Lonman Productions Karaoke & my main site via my profile!
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Lonman
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Posted: Wed Jan 11, 2017 10:27 am |
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Joined: Mon Dec 10, 2001 3:57 pm
Posts: 22975
Songs: 35
Images: 3
Location: Tacoma, WA
Been Liked: 2126 times
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KaraokeIan wrote: Lonman wrote: cueball wrote: KaraokeIan wrote: I guess Bob sensed the same thing and I guess that's why you think we're alike. I thought you ARE Bob...... He is, he said so himself, must have forgotten! KaraokeIan wrote: Of course I'm Bob. Lonman figured that out years ago. viewtopic.php?f=1&t=35472&start=20#p417022Lonnie, you really need to work on sensing sarcasm. I think the sarcasm is referring to yourself as a third person! Bob said, Bob did, Bob.... _________________ LIKE Lonman on Facebook - Lonman Productions Karaoke & my main site via my profile!
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KaraokeIan
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Posted: Wed Jan 11, 2017 11:31 am |
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Joined: Sun Nov 20, 2011 3:04 pm
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Lonman, do your homework. Contact the KJs listed on Karaosoft's site's about page. They all know Bob and me and will certainly verify we're 2 different people. Look at my profile, my real name is Jeff, and that's how they know me. I use my middle name of Ian as to preserve some sense of anonymity. It does state that only admins here can see that, but I'm under the impression that you have access to that stuff by some of your previous comments. You started this a long time ago and I changed my name to Bobble to mess with you, and you haven't let go since. Why have you never tried to actually get to the bottom of this by simply contacting people who could verify it if it's that important to you? Unprovable accusations aren't a good argument, and I think it's your lack of a good argument on any subject we've debated that always bring you back to this finger pointing tactic as to divert peoples attention from the subject at hand. I'm not saying you can't keep your conspiracy theory alive, but I am saying that when you have no other argument than that, it makes you look like some farmer who keeps blaming his crop loss on aliens.
mrmarog, you're really reaching for straws by saying I'm acting like the victim. I'm not the ones complaining about anyone hurting my feelings and have been nothing but critical of those of you who do, and you know it, and so does anyone reading this. You can't just say things that don't make sense and assume people will believe it. This forum is not all Trump supporters. Some people can think for themselves, and read. At least Lonman's tactic would maybe make some people wonder, but your strategy of trying to flip the tables could only be believed by anyone who can't read and form a complete thought on their own.
The fact is, regardless of all your side arguments and theories, that you and Chris are just as overly sensitive as Bob and none of you will ever admit it. I simply pointed out that your words pretty much did the admitting for you, and that's when all the diversion tactics started. Let's just say it's no coincidence. I'll take it as a sign that you've had enough and can't handle any more. Which, once again, only makes my argument stronger. I'm not the one giving up. I'll stay on topic as long as you want, but let's be honest, that's not what you want, and it's pretty clear why.
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dsm2000
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Posted: Wed Jan 11, 2017 12:31 pm |
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KaraokeIan wrote: Lonman, do your homework. Contact the KJs listed on Karaosoft's site's about page. They all know Bob and me and will certainly verify we're 2 different people. You'll have to pardon us for the confusion as we already know Bob is 2 or more people. Bob is a very nice person until he suddenly, for no reason at all becomes Bob the A$$hat I never had a problem corresponding with Bob1. He was always quick to reply and worked as best as he could(being a one man show) to fix user problems. On one version release I could not even open Karma and we did quite a bit of back and forth troubleshooting and he was great. He just couldn't reproduce the problem on his end so there was really nothing he could do. I kept working on it for two days and finally isolated the problem. The new version of Karma was trying to use the bass library that was already installed on my computer by Power Karaoke's cdgBurner+ program and was crashing as a result. I emailed Bob1 my solution on Xmas eve and he actually fixed the issue that very night(Xmas eve). He uploaded the new fixed release and even thanked me publicly for tracking down the problem. Fast forward to Karma 2015 and the new database format. I emailed that the new format did not protect singer history and that I believed singer history should be placed in it's own independent chronological timeline-history table that should not be affected by any adds, changes, or deletions to paths, singers, or song titles. Enter Bob2 - Well . . . we all know Bob2 . . . He went off in a demeaning tirade on how I didn't know what the hell I was talking about etc etc. I was Truly floored and actually thought at the time . . . This can't be the same guy I've been corresponding with the past four years. I have been designing inventory software for Auto Recycling yards since 1996 and I have never treated a customer like that. Flexibility and data integrity are the primary requirements of good database design and his new version violates both.
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KaraokeIan
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Posted: Wed Jan 11, 2017 2:57 pm |
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Joined: Sun Nov 20, 2011 3:04 pm
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dsm2000 wrote: KaraokeIan wrote: Lonman, do your homework. Contact the KJs listed on Karaosoft's site's about page. They all know Bob and me and will certainly verify we're 2 different people. You'll have to pardon us for the confusion as we already know Bob is 2 or more people. Bob is a very nice person until he suddenly, for no reason at all becomes Bob the A$$hat I never had a problem corresponding with Bob1. He was always quick to reply and worked as best as he could(being a one man show) to fix user problems. On one version release I could not even open Karma and we did quite a bit of back and forth troubleshooting and he was great. He just couldn't reproduce the problem on his end so there was really nothing he could do. I kept working on it for two days and finally isolated the problem. The new version of Karma was trying to use the bass library that was already installed on my computer by Power Karaoke's cdgBurner+ program and was crashing as a result. I emailed Bob1 my solution on Xmas eve and he actually fixed the issue that very night(Xmas eve). He uploaded the new fixed release and even thanked me publicly for tracking down the problem. Fast forward to Karma 2015 and the new database format. I emailed that the new format did not protect singer history and that I believed singer history should be placed in it's own independent chronological timeline-history table that should not be affected by any adds, changes, or deletions to paths, singers, or song titles. Enter Bob2 - Well . . . we all know Bob2 . . . He went off in a demeaning tirade on how I didn't know what the hell I was talking about etc etc. I was Truly floored and actually thought at the time . . . This can't be the same guy I've been corresponding with the past four years. I have been designing inventory software for Auto Recycling yards since 1996 and I have never treated a customer like that. Flexibility and data integrity are the primary requirements of good database design and his new version violates both. I think this is where communication by messaging or email creates this illusion. If you leave your house for work in the morning and your wife kisses you goodbye and everything seems fine, yet you get home to her chewing you out for something, you have clear evidence that it's still your wife because you know what she looks like. We all know its the same person, and his tirade mode can be predicted at this point. We all know he definitely gets offended at those who suggest they know more than him. We also all know that he doesn't like any customer acting like he owes them anything more than the product and support they paid for. Most entrepreneurs have the attitude that they know best when it comes to their business and some businesses don't go the extra mile to do out of the way things for their customers. Some customers don't like these attitudes that exist in many businesses, but what sets Bob apart is his ability to end a conversation very quickly regardless of what he has to say to do it. It's those things he says that offends people. You were offended that he told you that you didn't know what you're doing. The reason I defend him is that I work in a trade and I don't like customers telling me how to do my job either. Now I have a boss and I can't be as brutally honest as Bob is, but when I see him do it, I have to admit part of me is glad to see someone finally say those things. Skilled people don't spend years learning their craft so that others (without those skills) can act like they have them. Frankly its ignorant and any skilled person finds that offensive. As far as doing extra things for customers, Bob has done those too. I just think the size of his customer base has grown to the point where he doesn't have the time to make everyone happy. That's not Bob's fault, and I defend that too. All of us lose some patience when we're overloaded. Sure its easy to say that I'd handle things differently, but I have to remember I'm not in his shoes. If he got offensive with people for NO reason, then you can call him crazy and just plain mean. This isn't the case. If you don't ask Bob for special favors and don't act like you know more about his job than he does, you shouldn't have any problem, and no one who shows those courtesies to him has ever come forward and claimed he was offensive to them. Chris is claiming he is one of those mystery cases where he did nothing to offend Bob, and part of me wants to believe him because he seems to be one of the more polite, rational, and intelligent people here, but the fact that he won't simply post the conversation is suspicious. Of course Chris also told us for years that he's working on his own hosting app, but we have yet to see a screen shot. It's making me suspect other things he's claimed over the years, as it should you too.
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chrisavis
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Posted: Wed Jan 11, 2017 5:10 pm |
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Joined: Fri Dec 02, 2011 12:38 pm
Posts: 6085
Images: 1
Location: Redmond, WA
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KaraokeIan - I spent some time on the east coast when I was younger. We lived in Hagerstown for a short while and I went to Edgewood High School in Edgewood, Maryland. However, since you have never seen even a screenshot of anything I have worked on, I don't expect you to believe me. But if the need ever did arise, I have my Edgewood Rams 1982 Yearbook that I can scan pics from.
Your veiled insults at me, as well as my father's parenting reveal something about your character. It's very similar to how Bob would speak so I am happy that I didn't spend enough time on the east coast to pick up whatever it is that makes people like you and Bob. I much prefer the southern hospitality I picked up in my years in NC, SC, TN, and TX.
That said, if you want to throw down verbal insults, I have already suggested we take it to Facebook where it won't bother the good folks here and neither of us will be subject to bans.
Finally......I mentioned in another thread with you that I had given mrmarog a beta of a program to play with. That program is what I call "Venue Picker for Karma". It is a launcher (meaning you run VPfK, make your changes, then it launches Karma) that does some simple things to allow a KJ to manage unique song and singer databases on a per venue basis with Karma. In fact, it allows you to manage ALL Karma settings and configurations on a per venue basis. Bob doesn't think this kind of functionality is desired by KJs, nor does he feel it is useful or "relevant". Of course Bob didn't think reporting was desired, useful or relevant either until he put it in and saw his sales go up.
It's that kind of shortsightedness that pushes people like me to fill in the gaps that other people leave. In fact, the tagline for this project is "Software that makes other software better."
Have a nice day!
_________________
-Chris
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Lonman
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Posted: Wed Jan 11, 2017 5:52 pm |
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Joined: Mon Dec 10, 2001 3:57 pm
Posts: 22975
Songs: 35
Images: 3
Location: Tacoma, WA
Been Liked: 2126 times
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KaraokeIan wrote: Lonman, do your homework. Contact the KJs listed on Karaosoft's site's about page. They all know Bob and me and will certainly verify we're 2 different people. Look at my profile, my real name is Jeff, and that's how they know me. I use my middle name of Ian as to preserve some sense of anonymity. It does state that only admins here can see that, but I'm under the impression that you have access to that stuff by some of your previous comments. You started this a long time ago and I changed my name to Bobble to mess with you, and you haven't let go since. Why have you never tried to actually get to the bottom of this by simply contacting people who could verify it if it's that important to you? Unprovable accusations aren't a good argument, and I think it's your lack of a good argument on any subject we've debated that always bring you back to this finger pointing tactic as to divert peoples attention from the subject at hand. I'm not saying you can't keep your conspiracy theory alive, but I am saying that when you have no other argument than that, it makes you look like some farmer who keeps blaming his crop loss on aliens. Sorry the 'bobble' moniker was registered to Bob L (even mrmarog said this) with his Latshaw email at the time (I sent emails from the link he provided here in his profile, asking questions and got responses), joined Sep 2005, quit being active Nov 20 2011 3:51PM. Your moniker didn't even come into play until you joined Nov 20 2011 4:04PM (13 minutes after Bobble's last login - this isn't special admin stuff either, anyone can look at the profiles of each) - quite the coincidence, guess he asked you to sign up right after he decided to quit logging in to defend his honor?? So there was no 'switching' your name to Bobble to mess with me since you came afterward. _________________ LIKE Lonman on Facebook - Lonman Productions Karaoke & my main site via my profile!
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KaraokeIan
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Posted: Wed Jan 11, 2017 6:33 pm |
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Joined: Sun Nov 20, 2011 3:04 pm
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chrisavis wrote: Finally......I mentioned in another thread with you that I had given mrmarog a beta of a program to play with. That program is what I call "Venue Picker for Karma". It is a launcher (meaning you run VPfK, make your changes, then it launches Karma) that does some simple things to allow a KJ to manage unique song and singer databases on a per venue basis with Karma. In fact, it allows you to manage ALL Karma settings and configurations on a per venue basis. Bob doesn't think this kind of functionality is desired by KJs, nor does he feel it is useful or "relevant". Of course Bob didn't think reporting was desired, useful or relevant either until he put it in and saw his sales go up.
It's that kind of shortsightedness that pushes people like me to fill in the gaps that other people leave. In fact, the tagline for this project is "Software that makes other software better."in
Have a nice day! Karma already has a way to do that with the "New Show" option under the main menu. It let's you pick venue specific list of singers, venue message, and filler playlist. What you're doing sounds like something that just switches the database file and keeps separate ones for each venue. It sounds good, but there is one flaw in it that approach. How would you later go back and get any kind of reports on all of your history, like most sung songs, etc...? You completely lost any way of getting any info that applies to all venues together unless you build your own reporting engine too. If I'm wrong then you need to explain it better, but I can certainly see how you and bob could get into a debate over who's approach is better. This goes back to my point about you both being too sensitive. So what if he doesn't like your idea? I'm sure not everyone liked Bob's ideas either, but at least he's putting them out there for the rest of us to choose from. It takes balls to put your stuff our there for the world to see and criticize, but you're never going to know until you try. Chris, I don't push you to have some balls once in a while to actually fight with anyone. THIS is the reason I challenge you, so you can stop talking about all these things and actually do them. If you can't, then stop talking about them if they're only going to be nothing more than a home hobby for you. If you do ever decide to create something to release, personally, I don't think making plugins for other apps is a good idea. Make your own hosting program. Winamp used to allow plugins and look where they are now. All the people that made plugins got screwed. Also, what if Bob changes the database format again?
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RLC
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Posted: Wed Jan 11, 2017 6:47 pm |
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Joined: Thu Jan 18, 2007 6:30 pm
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Lonman wrote: Sorry the 'bobble' moniker was registered to Bob with his email at the time (I sent emails from the link he provided here asking questions and got responses) joined Sep 2005, quit being active Nov 20 2011 3:51PM. Your moniker didn't even come into play until you joined Nov 20 2011 4:04PM (13 minutes after Bobble's last login - this isn't special admin stuff either, anyone can look at the profiles of each) - quite the coincidence, guess he asked you to sign up right after he decided to quit logging in to defend his honor?? So there was no 'switching' your name to Bobble to mess with me since you came afterward. So KaraokeIan....If you act like a duck, swim like a duck, and quack like a duck, then you probably are a duck! Substitute "Bob" for "a duck". No surprise here, knew this for a long time now.
_________________
Music speaks to the heart in ways words cannot express.
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